[Nine Lives]

Interesting results with Sutcliffe at the helm !

[M-Pilot]

So they compared two manuals and a DCT? Seriously? This is not a fair comparison from the beginning. All should have been manuals.

Also, I don't think this guys know what he's doing either. M4's throttle was set to Efficient!!! On a track test... Are you f* kidding me? Who knows what M2 was set to (Comfort/Sport/Sport+)

[Haslamhazza]

Originally Posted by Nine Lives

Interesting results with Sutcliffe at the helm !

Well, what he's saying is the M2 is best😜

[Nine Lives]

Originally Posted by ByeByeAmg

re post from the earlier thread in the vs section, Dackelone

You need to re-read the post times

[Pol]

"The less money you spent on your BMW ///M car the best value your get."

[swagon]

Originally Posted by cntzl

So they compared two manuals and a DCT? Seriously? This is not a fair comparison from the beginning. All should have been manuals.

True, I agree. However, it is very possible that there is not a single M4 in the BMW UK press fleet available with a manual transmission.

Originally Posted by cntzl

Also, I don't think this guys know what he's doing either. M4's throttle was set to Efficient!!! On a track test... Are you f* kidding me? Who knows what M2 was set to (Comfort/Sport/Sport+)

The tacho clips were recorded separately if you look carefully. You cannot see the camera that would otherwise be sitting on the steering column.

And the settings (E. throttle / S+ dampers /S. steering) might be Steve's favourite. There's a reason driving modes exist and can be changed to everyone's liking, you know.

I was cringing at the cold engine temps of the M4, tbh.

The 1 M did really well; better than I thought. Love the car.

[M-Pilot]

Originally Posted by swagon

True, I agree. However, it is very possible that there is not a single M4 in the BMW UK press fleet available with a manual transmission.



The tacho clips were recorded separately if you look carefully. You cannot see the camera that would otherwise be sitting on the steering column.

And the settings (E. throttle / S+ dampers /S. steering) might be Steve's favourite. There's a reason driving modes exist and can be changed to everyone's liking, you know.

I was cringing at the cold engine temps of the M4, tbh.

The 1 M did really well; better than I thought. Love the car.

Although it might be his favorite, I don't think Efficient is ideal for track use. I don't know if you drove an M3/4 before but there is a noticeable difference between Efficient and Sport+ throttle settings in terms of both throttle response and shift points. Therefore, these settings play a role in his overall time.

[koastal]

On last Fridays track day. A M2 was 4 seconds quicker than the 2 M4,s that were there. It was a dct though, but so where the M4,s.

[redux]

Originally Posted by cntzl

Although it might be his favorite, I don't think Efficient is ideal for track use. I don't know if you drove an M3/4 before but there is a noticeable difference between Efficient and Sport+ throttle settings in terms of both throttle response and shift points. Therefore, these settings play a role in his overall time.

He'd probably be slower in Sport+, a short throttle pedal isn't the greatest thing to have in a car with traction limitations and a lot of torque.

[zenmaster]

Originally Posted by cntzl

So they compared two manuals and a DCT? Seriously? This is not a fair comparison from the beginning. All should have been manuals.

Also, I don't think this guys know what he's doing either. M4's throttle was set to Efficient!!! On a track test... Are you f* kidding me? Who knows what M2 was set to (Comfort/Sport/Sport+)

A bad comparison, but at least you still know what does what.

[M-Pilot]

Originally Posted by redux

He'd probably be slower in Sport+, a short throttle pedal isn't the greatest thing to have in a car with traction limitations and a lot of torque.

Another advantage of Sport+ by another forum member:

"More aggressive use of the anti-lag system thus faster acceleration out of the corners. Also keeps the engine noticably cooler in sport plus."

[CosmosMpower]

I thought the M2 was far superior, more flickable, tossable and agile than the giant heavy grand touring M4 though?!?

[Robin_NL]

Originally Posted by CosmosMpower

I thought the M2 was far superior, more flickable, tossable and agile than the giant heavy grand touring M4 though?!?

And it is. 100%. The M4 Comp mainly wins because of its power advantage of 70 crank hp. Irl that will be 100whp. But I think M2 is not your kind of car if you can't/won't even feel the difference in size between M2 and M4 when normal driving, sorry.


Cheers
Robin

[Robin_NL]

Originally Posted by Pol

"The less money you spent on your BMW ///M car the best value your get."

This.

Cheers
Robin

[CosmosMpower]

Originally Posted by Robin_NL

And it is. 100%. The M4 Comp mainly wins because of its power advantage of 70 crank hp. Irl that will be 100whp. But I think M2 is not your kind of car if you can't/won't even feel the difference in size between M2 and M4 when normal driving, sorry.


Cheers
Robin

Oh I wasn't aware a 19 hp increase on a 'big heavy' boat car would make all the difference in the world and magically make it faster than the M2....clueless Dutch fool as usual.

[Robin_NL]

Originally Posted by CosmosMpower

Oh I wasn't aware a 19 hp increase on a 'big heavy' boat car would make all the difference in the world and magically make it faster than the M2....clueless Dutch fool as usual.

[EDITED]On topic: 100whp more and 2cms more rubber than M2, no sh1t Sherlock....

Aha I see you're Asian. No offence. I 'm not(doh) but I like them a lot.Not kidding. I thought I was talking to another redneck like myself lol
*shake hands*


Cheers
Robin

[CosmosMpower]

Originally Posted by Robin_NL

[EDITED]On topic: 100whp more and 2cms more rubber than M2, no sh1t Sherlock....

Aha I see you're Asian. No offence. I 'm not(doh) but I like them a lot.Not kidding. I thought I was talking to another redneck like myself lol
*shake hands*


Cheers
Robin

The non ZCP M3/M4 was already 100 WHP more (425-430 RWHP vs 330 RWHP) and 10 CM more rubber than the M2 (245/265 vs 255/275).

So you're saying a sub 4% bump in power and 10 more CM in rubber magically changes the M4 from a fat heavy pig that's slower than the M2 to a great performing car?

[Robin_NL]

Originally Posted by CosmosMpower

The non ZCP M3/M4 was already 100 WHP more (425-430 RWHP vs 330 RWHP) and 10 CM more rubber than the M2 (245/265 vs 255/275).

So you're saying a sub 4% bump in power and 10 more CM in rubber magically changes the M4 from a fat heavy pig that's slower than the M2 to a great performing car?

The M4 Comp (1638kgs? lightweight materials?)stays the bigger pig it is.Though not really heavier than M2, they souped up the suspension/wheels, you know. So it's even faster than a normal M4.

So why is it faster? Not in turn in/bends in general. It is mainly faster because of the 100ish whp difference and more rubber. Not because it's more agile or something than the M2. Because it's not

M4 Comp is the car it should have been from the start imho.

Cheers
Robin

[Robin_NL]

I know I know but sometimes I miss my 1M....

REPOST

Cheers
Robin

[gthal]

Originally Posted by CosmosMpower

I thought the M2 was far superior, more flickable, tossable and agile than the giant heavy grand touring M4 though?!?

It is more flickable, tossable and agile than the M4. I haven't driven an M4CP so can't comment there.

Originally Posted by CosmosMpower

Oh I wasn't aware a 19 hp increase on a 'big heavy' boat car would make all the difference in the world and magically make it faster than the M2....clueless Dutch fool as usual.

The CP is more than just HP. The M4 isn't a "big, heavy boat" but it does feel a lot bigger when you are behind the steering wheel. Why don't you tell us your thoughts based on driving them both back to back?

Originally Posted by CosmosMpower

The non ZCP M3/M4 was already 100 WHP more (425-430 RWHP vs 330 RWHP) and 10 CM more rubber than the M2 (245/265 vs 255/275).

So you're saying a sub 4% bump in power and 10 more CM in rubber magically changes the M4 from a fat heavy pig that's slower than the M2 to a great performing car?

Many reports suggest the CP does, in fact, notably improve on the M4. I have little doubt the M4 CP is a better car than the M2 and I have little doubt it is better than the regular M4. No surprise here. However, the driving experience is different than an M2 and what someone likes better is subjective. We have seen the M2 outperform the regular M4 on a number of tracks (or match it at least). This just highlights that the CP improves on the regular M4 to keep ahead of the smaller, more agile, well balanced M2

I always find it interesting when you join the discussion... it is very entertaining

[CosmosMpower]

Originally Posted by Robin_NL

The M4 Comp (1638kgs? lightweight materials?)stays the bigger pig it is.Though not really heavier than M2, they souped up the suspension/wheels, you know. So it's even faster than a normal M4.

So why is it faster? Not in turn in/bends in general. It is mainly faster because of the 100ish whp difference and more rubber. Not because it's more agile or something than the M2. Because it's not

M4 Comp is the car it should have been from the start imho.

Cheers
Robin

But that track is tiny and full of tight twists/turns more akin to a fast autocross than a large road course. So how did the M4 go faster?

[CosmosMpower]

Originally Posted by gthal

It is more flickable, tossable and agile than the M4. I haven't driven an M4CP so can't comment there.



The CP is more than just HP. The M4 isn't a "big, heavy boat" but it does feel a lot bigger when you are behind the steering wheel. Why don't you tell us your thoughts based on driving them both back to back?



Many reports suggest the CP does, in fact, notably improve on the M4. I have little doubt the M4 CP is a better car than the M2 and I have little doubt it is better than the regular M4. No surprise here. However, the driving experience is different than an M2 and what someone likes better is subjective. We have seen the M2 outperform the regular M4 on a number of tracks (or match it at least). This just highlights that the CP improves on the regular M4 to keep ahead of the smaller, more agile, well balanced M2

I always find it interesting when you join the discussion... it is very entertaining

I haven't driven a ZCP car yet but have driven a F80 and F87. I was mostly poking fun that some people think the ZCP is so much better because of a tiny bump in HP and a 10mm increase in tire width.

Obviously the increase in power and tire width doesn't turn what they thought was a big fat/heavy GT style car into a good handling track car when their major complaints were the size and weight of the chassis. If anything the increased grip gives it less 'agility'.