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      01-12-2020, 11:53 AM   #1
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Bmw F series N55 HPFP upgrades

Just wanted to start a thread highlighting the possible HPFP upgrades for the N55 M2. Thus all % overstock is compared to the OEM n55 hpfp, except the spool performance pump which is based off of the B58 cam profile from their website, so N55 results may be a few percent lower.

XDI:

1) XDI-35: ~36% flow over stock
2) XDI-60: ~60% flow over stock

warranty: I believe is 1 year
Tuning: MHD and BM3 supported
Compatibility: As of writing this post, it is only F series N55 compatible.
This is also the most expensive option available, and their comparable models flow less than the competition.


Spool performance:

1) FX-150: ~50% flow over stock
2) FX-180: ~78% over stock, this has been rumored on facebook and now is appearing as part of a comparison graph on their FX-150 hpfp.

Warranty: Life time
Tuning: as of writing this it is not MHD or BM3 supported and likely will need a custom remap.
Compatible: F series N55 and B58
These are significantly cheaper than XDI while also flowing significantly more as well.


DORCH engineering:
1) Stage 1: ~44% over stock
2) Stage 2: ~75% over stock
Compatible: F series N55 and B58
Tuning: BM3 and MHD supported
as of writing this it is not MHD supported and likely will need a custom remap, they also offer a free bin adjustment if you send them your ECU bin files.
Warranty and pricing at the time of this post is unknown, but they are likely to be less than XDI as well in terms of price. These pumps also flow significantly more than the XDI as well.


B58:
1) B58C: Also known as the bosch HDP5 evo hpfp which can make up to 250 bar of fuel pressure according to bosch's website and flow 0.897 cc/rev according to dorch engineering depending on which engine and cam profile it is used on (I believe the B58 cam profile allows it to have a higher cc/rev vs. the N55).
Overall this yields: ~7% more fuel flow

2) B58D: also known as the bosch HDP6 hpfp capable of making up to 350 bar of fuel pressure according to bosch's website and flow 1.107 cc/rev according to dorch engineering depending on what cam profile it is using which is engine dependent. This HPFP is on the Toyota supra, and European models of the Z4m40i, and various other bmws and mini's with the B48.
Overall this yields: ~32% more fuel flow (essentially XDI-35 levels)



These are all the HPFP upgrades that I have ever heard of both on the forums and from facebook groups + the respective manufacturer's teasing on product releases Instagram, please let me know if you guys have heard of any other options and I'll add it to the list.
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Last edited by F87source; 03-22-2020 at 04:49 PM..
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      01-12-2020, 01:27 PM   #2
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Can add the b58 and Supra pumps too.
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      01-12-2020, 02:58 PM   #3
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Interesting that Dorch allows you to send them your BIN file (BM3/MHD) for map adjustments. We never received such an offer from Spool which would have been nice seeing as we don't have MHD support (w/o a custom tune) just yet or a commitment that they will support it.

+1 for this thread ...
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      01-12-2020, 03:41 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony1s View Post
Can add the b58 and Supra pumps too.
+1

Also these pumps (excluding XDI) are also cross platform compatible meaning they work with the B58 as well, just specify and they'll send you a b58 specific base plate.
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      01-12-2020, 03:42 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///Monika View Post
Interesting that Dorch allows you to send them your BIN file (BM3/MHD) for map adjustments. We never received such an offer from Spool which would have been nice seeing as we don't have MHD support (w/o a custom tune) just yet or a commitment that they will support it.

+1 for this thread ...
It should be integrated into MHD as a "one touch checkable" feature that allows mhd to make the required changes into the map, but this is probably in the distant future.
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      01-12-2020, 03:45 PM   #6
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That's what concerning us. We're placing a Spool order next week and will have no way to start the car. Well, that is unless we pay for a custom tune which were not quite ready for yet OR simply wait for integrated support.

Found this unboxing video for FX-150:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPO3ToSM96c

Quote:
Originally Posted by F87source View Post
It should be integrated into MHD as a "one touch checkable" feature that allows mhd to make the required changes into the map, but this is probably in the distant future.

Last edited by ///Monika; 01-12-2020 at 03:47 PM.. Reason: Added unboxing vid.
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      01-12-2020, 03:59 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///Monika View Post
That's what concerning us. We're placing a Spool order next week and will have no way to start the car. Well, that is unless we pay for a custom tune which were not quite ready for yet OR simply wait for integrated support.

Found this unboxing video for FX-150:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iPO3ToSM96c
Yeah I know, this was how it was for the XDI pumps as well, you would have to get a base map from TTFS.

IMO I would just wait for awhile till everything gets sorted out and there is more data on the pumps. Plus now that there is alot more competition prices should drop soon.
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      01-12-2020, 06:43 PM   #8
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When is a HPFP recommended on our N55 cars?
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      01-12-2020, 07:29 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jessetaylor1 View Post
When is a HPFP recommended on our N55 cars?
When you've done all the supporting mods (charge pipes down pipe, intercooler, tune etc) and see your hpfp pressure not being able to hit their targets while trying to make more power.

Or your factory pump dies and you're planning for more power in the future.
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      01-12-2020, 09:51 PM   #10
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The OEM supra pump by far the best option. Low cost. OEM, plug and play. Require no remapping. Support 450+whp on E50 no issue.

Going further you need meth anyway.
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      01-12-2020, 10:27 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanWRT View Post
The OEM supra pump by far the best option. Low cost. OEM, plug and play. Require no remapping. Support 450+whp on E50 no issue.
Agreed on the low cost and no remapping + horse power supported.

I disagree on PnP since you need to notch the base plate, bend an extremely stiff fuel line hose. The overall result is a ghetto mounted hpfp that is secured by a very small amount of metal on the outer edge of the base plate and this whole assembly is subjected to a cam driven system with high vibration especially at high RPM's. It's just so sketchy I don't like that idea.

I don't like mixing fuel, and want to just be able to fully utilize the upcoming MHD flexfuel module and switch between 94 octane pump gas and E85 on the fly no messing with ethanol concentrations and having the car run poorly when concentrations are missed. I want the car to adapt from any ethanol concentration 0-85% so I don't have to guess how much pump gas is left in the tank, or how much ethanol to add.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanWRT View Post
Going further you need meth anyway.
This is absolutely false if utilizing E85 or a fuel with sufficent octane.

E85 can support upwards of 1,000 whp if your fuel system is capable and turbos can flow that much air. In terms of heat produced ethanol can cool the combustion temperatures and has an extremely high octane rating so IAT's have less of an impact. Clearly you need an intercooler that is rated for that power level, and turbos operating in their efficiency range as well, but saying you need meth past 450 whp is absolutely inaccurate. There are GTR's out there operating at 1,000 - 2,000 whp from AMS on E85 without any forms of meth injection and they run fine even on hot days.

E50 has been used to hit 700 whp on the m4 and m5. So saying you need meth to go further anyway without any context whatsoever is hugely false and misleading.
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      01-13-2020, 05:21 PM   #12
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Yes, very true. It would be beneficial to see some feedback/performance results from those who were actually involved in field testing these products. One also has to wonder how different these units really are from one another (aside from output capacity).

For us (at least), it was an end-to-end solution (rail to tank). We hate piecing kits together and hoping that everything works out (e.g. fittings). A bit surprised that Spool didn't offer a hard line option from the HPFP to the rail (only avail. on the Helix). Was hoping for an OEM appearance.

Quote:
Originally Posted by F87source View Post
IMO I would just wait for awhile till everything gets sorted out and there is more data on the pumps. Plus now that there is alot more competition prices should drop soon.
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      01-13-2020, 06:09 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///Monika View Post
Yes, very true. It would be beneficial to see some feedback/performance results from those who were actually involved in field testing these products. One also has to wonder how different these units really are from one another (aside from output capacity).

For us (at least), it was an end-to-end solution (rail to tank). We hate piecing kits together and hoping that everything works out (e.g. fittings). A bit surprised that Spool didn't offer a hard line option from the HPFP to the rail (only avail. on the Helix). Was hoping for an OEM appearance.
Yeah you never want to be a lab rat for a super expensive product imo.

Yeah spool does offer a stainless an fuel line upgrade, just email them and ask.
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      01-13-2020, 06:19 PM   #14
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Odd, we did inquire about the SS hard line. This was their answer when asked:
Quote:
The hardline is only for our other product - the helix which is for n54 motors. The fx pumps only come with the flex lines.
They told you differently ?
Quote:
Originally Posted by F87source View Post
Yeah you never want to be a lab rat for a super expensive product imo.

Yeah spool does offer a stainless an fuel line upgrade, just email them and ask.
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      01-13-2020, 06:29 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///Monika View Post
Odd, we did inquire about the SS hard line. This was their answer when asked:

They told you differently ?
Yeah I asked about the fuel line going from the hpfp all the way back to the lpfp and they said yes, I may have to double check.
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      01-14-2020, 10:46 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F87source View Post
Agreed on the low cost and no remapping + horse power supported.

I disagree on PnP since you need to notch the base plate, bend an extremely stiff fuel line hose. The overall result is a ghetto mounted hpfp that is secured by a very small amount of metal on the outer edge of the base plate and this whole assembly is subjected to a cam driven system with high vibration especially at high RPM's. It's just so sketchy I don't like that idea.

I don't like mixing fuel, and want to just be able to fully utilize the upcoming MHD flexfuel module and switch between 94 octane pump gas and E85 on the fly no messing with ethanol concentrations and having the car run poorly when concentrations are missed. I want the car to adapt from any ethanol concentration 0-85% so I don't have to guess how much pump gas is left in the tank, or how much ethanol to add.




This is absolutely false if utilizing E85 or a fuel with sufficent octane.

E85 can support upwards of 1,000 whp if your fuel system is capable and turbos can flow that much air. In terms of heat produced ethanol can cool the combustion temperatures and has an extremely high octane rating so IAT's have less of an impact. Clearly you need an intercooler that is rated for that power level, and turbos operating in their efficiency range as well, but saying you need meth past 450 whp is absolutely inaccurate. There are GTR's out there operating at 1,000 - 2,000 whp from AMS on E85 without any forms of meth injection and they run fine even on hot days.

E50 has been used to hit 700 whp on the m4 and m5. So saying you need meth to go further anyway without any context whatsoever is hugely false and misleading.
Have you got any links to the upcoming MHD Flex Fuel module?
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      01-15-2020, 12:05 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dec540 View Post
Have you got any links to the upcoming MHD Flex Fuel module?
No, however it is scheduled as a future MHD project just like the F series Wifi adapter was. As you can see in this thread: https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1450580

It will likely be similar to the E series N54 flexfuel set up with MHD, if they manage to get a canbus hub setup like ecutek then it will be equally as advanced. I personally picked MHD over ecutek because it is more user friendly with one touch on and off features for HPFPs, coil kits, speed limiters, and cold start unlike ecutek which is heavily reliant on the tuner.
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      01-15-2020, 08:46 AM   #18
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Update: the dorch engineering hpfp is now compatible with BM3.
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      01-15-2020, 08:56 AM   #19
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Are we sure the B58C pump is only a 7% increase? I need to do something, my stock pump is crashing on my custom tune here, and the B58 looks to be plug and play, and relatively inexpensive.
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      01-15-2020, 09:29 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F87source View Post
Update: the dorch engineering hpfp is now compatible with BM3.
When will they be available?
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      01-15-2020, 09:58 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AmuroRay View Post
Are we sure the B58C pump is only a 7% increase? I need to do something, my stock pump is crashing on my custom tune here, and the B58 looks to be plug and play, and relatively inexpensive.
On the n55 cam profile using dorch engineering's numbers yes 7% is the calculated value. Looking at data points from other B58C pump users there is an improvement but logs show an hpfp crash with only a bit more ethanol or boost vs. the stock n55 pump.

It's no where near plug and play, you have to do alot of modifications and you have to Dremel the bottom of your intake manifold. Imo I wouldn't cheap out on an hpfp. There are better places to save money like intakes and downpipes.

You should do alot more research on hpfps before deciding which route to go.
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      01-15-2020, 09:59 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cecaa850 View Post
When will they be available?
I unfortunately don't know.
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