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      01-28-2016, 01:44 PM   #375
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Its headlights look larger than the Sedan Concept shown at the Guangzhou auto show.

I like the shape of the car so far. I might even get this in the future. The ULK is a great platform, so I'm not worried how this will drive.

What I'd be worried about is if they don't bring a smaller CLAR coupe to sit underneath the future 4-series. I know there are a lot of conflicting reports about that. I'll feel better when they finally show a small RWD coupe test mule in the future.
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      01-28-2016, 06:42 PM   #376
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New FWD 1 Series, our re-sale values will go up.
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      01-28-2016, 06:44 PM   #377
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Originally Posted by ///MDriver View Post
Who cares if they're going fwd thats only one 1 series, the basic cars. If they're going to move from the rwd platform they'll probably just go to awd/xdrive, just look at the i8. You dont have to buy a 1 series, they'll have something for everyone. And they're going to have xdrive 1er anyway so np.
I care because to me, the real bmw line is e30 -> e36 -> e46 -> e82 -> f22. I saw the e90 as a five series. With a new fwd 1 series, a smallish fun to drive non-M bmw with a back seat is dead to me.
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      01-28-2016, 06:51 PM   #378
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Is it me or it looks like non-LCI (non-LED) taillights?

Going to released in 2017 with non LED tailights??? If so then

I'm actually looking forward to buying this sedan for my parents, too...
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      01-28-2016, 07:23 PM   #379
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How about a wagon version to compete with the A3 Sportback?
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      01-28-2016, 10:31 PM   #380
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Originally Posted by 111R View Post
How about a wagon version to compete with the A3 Sportback?
It will most likely exist in Europe/RoW for the next gen 1-series, but doubtful to come to the US since historically hatchbacks/wagons don't sell well. But then again there's some new contenders in the "hot hatch" category in the US with the new Focus RS, Golf R and rumored Civic Type R, so who knows...

As of now, the A3 sportback only comes in the e-tron plug in hybrid for the US market. The Sportback TDI was slated to come until the whole emissions scandal thing. That was on my list for a potential daily driver car.
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      01-29-2016, 07:57 AM   #381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colin_e90 View Post
If they bring this to the states they better bring the active and gran tourer as well. Fwd/xdrive hatch seems much more reasonable then a sedan counterpart. Was stoked hoping the active tourer would come to the USA but sadly it most likely won't :/
Reasonable in what way? For better or worse, American generally tastes favor a 3 box vs. a 2 box when it comes to non-SUVs. So that's what usually makes the best business case if we are speaking in terms of bringing only one or the other.

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Originally Posted by Mikecom32 View Post
So, I'm assuming that means the next gen 2er will be on the UKL platform, since the carbon platform is "35UP"?

By extension, I'm assuming that means the next gen M2 is going to be based on this FWD platform?

Seems like a race to the bottom..
There are current rumors that suggest a future 2 Series coupe, convertible and grand coupe will remain RWD. How this will be achieved platform-wise is unknown, which makes the rumors feel a bit less realistic than the more obvious choice of just moving everything in the compact segments to AWD/FWD like Mercedes and Audi (and pretty much everyone else, for that matter). Stay tuned in the coming year to see what new developments we learn on this very hotly debated topic.

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Originally Posted by KGB_123_99 View Post
As for the 1 series, why not just make a 2 series GC and call it a day?
They will reportedly build both. It is just as there is both a 3 Series sedan and 4 Series Gran Coupe, and both a 5 Series sedan and 6 Series Grand Coupe.

Although, most recent suggestions from insiders are that every model that is called a 1 Series today will become a 2 Series for the next generation. This allows the use of the 1 Series name for a new sub-compact lineup. So, it would mean both a 2 Series Sedan and Grand Coupe, which does start to crowd the nameplate, admittedly.

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Originally Posted by 111R View Post
How about a wagon version to compete with the A3 Sportback?
The A3 Sportback isn't really a wagon. BMW's 1 Series hatchback already occupies the same segment as the A3 Sportback. On our side of the pond, it is difficult to make money on compact luxury hatchbacks. In order to sell them, they must be priced to move with tiny margins because they generally appeal to a small group of people and those people typically won't spend a lot of money on them.
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      01-29-2016, 05:09 PM   #382
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I just don't know why BMWAG is spreading themselves so thin with this offering. I understand the desire to match the same size cars as their competitors, but as a premium brand how about offering more premium rich features inside their models, rather then reshaping the same cookie-cutter mold and stamping another one with a slopped roof, or 4 inches shorter, Etc.
Be BOLD BMW and go back to cutting edge features; the designs are great! And no, gesture control does not count. Perfect voice control, A/C seats (no fans), full-autonomous cruise, bio-metrics finger-tip start, full digital dash across all lines, full panoramic roof all models (non-SAV), temperature controlled cup holders (hot/cold), etc. Premium features that I can't find on a Ford, Chevy, Kia, Hyundai, Audi, Cadillac, Lincoln, MB, Porsche, etc. If time is spent looking at what the other brands have already on the table, you'll see that BMW is slowing down. All the manufacturers have caught-up to ride/handling but yet BMW is changing that now to match softer rides. Carbon fiber and i8, i3....great but I'm talking about what brings in the bread/butter and offering more to the loyalists who purchase year after year. 17 yrs with the brand, and now I'm really looking and the trend is not good in my opinion.
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      01-29-2016, 07:48 PM   #383
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel
Reasonable in what way? For better or worse, American generally tastes favor a 3 box vs. a 2 box when it comes to non-SUVs. So that's what usually makes the best business case if we are speaking in terms of bringing only one or the other.
In the way that you tend to see more hatchbacks lately then say half a decade ago. The hatchback market is growing in the USA at least it is the west coast and Hawaii, atarting to notice brands like ford and Mazda and Chevy selling more of their smaller hatchbacks as they tend to be on the road more then their other counterparts. For instance ford sells more of the hatch variant of their focus then their sedan version. Mazda you see a bunch of Mazda 2 and 3's. Audi and Volkswagens a3 hatch and golf always have sold well. You are correct Thoe on that the hatchback market really only tends to the 35 and under crowd. Typically the younger generation and the young family. If now is going to bring it to the USA it'll most likely be their cheapest models to date because like you said it's a market that generally won't spend much of a premium, but if bmw brings it to market here it will be the higher end of the hatchback bunch
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      01-30-2016, 01:26 AM   #384
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flyga3 View Post
Be BOLD BMW and go back to cutting edge features; the designs are great! And no, gesture control does not count. Perfect voice control, A/C seats (no fans), full-autonomous cruise, bio-metrics finger-tip start, full digital dash across all lines, full panoramic roof all models (non-SAV), temperature controlled cup holders (hot/cold), etc. Premium features that I can't find on a Ford, Chevy, Kia, Hyundai, Audi, Cadillac, Lincoln, MB, Porsche, etc. If time is spent looking at what the other brands have already on the table, you'll see that BMW is slowing down. All the manufacturers have caught-up to ride/handling but yet BMW is changing that now to match softer rides. Carbon fiber and i8, i3....great but I'm talking about what brings in the bread/butter and offering more to the loyalists who purchase year after year. 17 yrs with the brand, and now I'm really looking and the trend is not good in my opinion.
I disagree with that direction. If you look back to a historic model like the E30, it was a no nonsense car with few fancy features, but great handling, RWD, good ergonomics inside, low weight and good looks. I would not want to pay extra for a panoramic roof that makes the car softer and top heavy, nor any of the other things you mention. I would rather prefer a limited slip differential as standard equipment on all models. Show that BMW is the brand that cares about active drivers.
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      01-30-2016, 07:32 AM   #385
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Sure, non-premium compact hatchbacks sell ok. But they also have more flexibility due to higher margins. Regarding the brands you mention, all are non-luxury except Audi, and they have eliminated the A3 hatchback from the US lineup now that there is a sedan, except for the new e-tron model which is very niche.

Quote:
Originally Posted by colin_e90 View Post
In the way that you tend to see more hatchbacks lately then say half a decade ago. The hatchback market is growing in the USA at least it is the west coast and Hawaii, atarting to notice brands like ford and Mazda and Chevy selling more of their smaller hatchbacks as they tend to be on the road more then their other counterparts. For instance ford sells more of the hatch variant of their focus then their sedan version. Mazda you see a bunch of Mazda 2 and 3's. Audi and Volkswagens a3 hatch and golf always have sold well. You are correct Thoe on that the hatchback market really only tends to the 35 and under crowd. Typically the younger generation and the young family. If now is going to bring it to the USA it'll most likely be their cheapest models to date because like you said it's a market that generally won't spend much of a premium, but if bmw brings it to market here it will be the higher end of the hatchback bunch
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      01-30-2016, 09:51 PM   #386
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Interesting report. I wonder if the US will see this model.
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      01-30-2016, 10:09 PM   #387
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Quote:
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Interesting report. I wonder if the US will see this model.
Seeing that the US x1 debuted in xdrive. I strongly believe we will see it in awd first. Maybe down the line they will release as a FWD.

Op, you will not see a rise in resale because most people don't know what wheel drive their car is.
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      01-31-2016, 12:23 AM   #388
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I think the 320 fill that gap United States. I don't think you'll see the front wheel drive one. Although people have the Mercedes front wheel drive One and it's nice looking car. People like it.
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      01-31-2016, 02:51 AM   #389
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I think the 320 fill that gap United States. I don't think you'll see the front wheel drive one. Although people have the Mercedes front wheel drive One and it's nice looking car. People like it.
The 320i was introduced to fill the gap that the CLA and A3 made. BMW didn't have a 1-series sedan available to bring over, and the US doesn't do well with hatches, so their best option was to make a cheaper 3 series in the mean time. Although I wonder why they didn't have the foresight to create a sedan variant, especially for the F2x 1/2 series, when they knew they were bringing it to the US.

The next gen 1 will definitely be sold in the US to go head to head against the CLA and A3. The new X1 has already popped the FWD cherry. 1 series is next. The people that buy these don't care about FWD or RWD.

Now with that being said, I do hope that they have a separate RWD based product plan for the 2 series. With the success of the 135i, 1M, M235i and soon M2 with the enthusiast buyers, it would be a huge letdown to make the next 2er FWD based. THESE are the buyers that know and care about the difference between FWD/RWD/AWD. But in reality, it will probably become a highly tuned turbo 4 with AWD like the CLA45 AMG and S3.
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      01-31-2016, 04:15 AM   #390
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ovekvam View Post
I disagree with that direction. If you look back to a historic model like the E30, it was a no nonsense car with few fancy features, but great handling, RWD, good ergonomics inside, low weight and good looks. I would not want to pay extra for a panoramic roof that makes the car softer and top heavy, nor any of the other things you mention. I would rather prefer a limited slip differential as standard equipment on all models. Show that BMW is the brand that cares about active drivers.
Agreed. All this pointless tech does nothing to improve handling or performance.

My dad had a new E21 323i decades ago; a brilliant car which he reckon an M135i has a similar ethos.

Luckily BMW has shed weight with the latest models but before that (E90, E60, etc) they were getting insanely heavy.

While I appreciate good Bluetooth and a few extras, I specced my car with weight in mind; so no heavy electric seats, mirrors, Advanced Hifi (too many speakers in HK and sounded too synthesised), etc.

Weight matters.
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      01-31-2016, 04:56 AM   #391
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BMW needs to cater for all customers and it built its base and reputation on awesome RWD saloons.

BMW can offer tech and FWD etc and that's fine, but if BMW stop making small RWD cars they will lose normal customers like me who actually understand what they might be buying.

It's very simple BMW, don't sell yourself short to pander to ignorance.

And I say this to all the folk in the UK who say you can't have RWD because of the snow...

What snow?!

BMW should do more to quell the British tradition of being terrified of RWD. And if we have did have snow one day, people need to drive to the conditions and buy proper tyres!
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      01-31-2016, 10:20 AM   #392
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Originally Posted by clbmw View Post
And I say this to all the folk in the UK who say you can't have RWD because of the snow...

What snow?!

BMW should do more to quell the British tradition of being terrified of RWD. And if we have did have snow one day, people need to drive to the conditions and buy proper tyres!
I could probably live with FWD in the summer, but snow is one of my main reasons to drive RWD. I have spent two entire days driving on snow now. Great fun!
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      01-31-2016, 02:15 PM   #393
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DanG
Interesting report. I wonder if the US will see this model.
I think this sedan model was designed with North American and Chinese as BMW's primary target markets. Hatchbacks are more popular in Europe.

With FWD platform BMW can bring down the manufacturing cost for 1 series. I am not sure how much of that saving will pass down to the consumers... F48 X1 definitely does it see any of the manufacturing saving in the retail price...
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      02-02-2016, 03:14 AM   #394
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I still can't believe that I will test drive a Front Wheel Drive BMW soon
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      02-03-2016, 12:12 PM   #395
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ovekvam View Post
I disagree with that direction. If you look back to a historic model like the E30, it was a no nonsense car with few fancy features, but great handling, RWD, good ergonomics inside, low weight and good looks. I would not want to pay extra for a panoramic roof that makes the car softer and top heavy, nor any of the other things you mention. I would rather prefer a limited slip differential as standard equipment on all models. Show that BMW is the brand that cares about active drivers.
Exactly. I don't mind the fancy stuff, I just don't want it to distract from the driving experience. And BMW doesn't even have to make the LSD standard, but at least give it as an option that can be purchased easily and doesn't have to be specifically ordered by the dealer. However, the new M-performance models should have the LSD standard. I can't imagine driving the M235i, especially in the wet, without a LSD.
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      02-03-2016, 07:21 PM   #396
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So while KIA is working on this, BMW is working on a front wheel drive competitor to the Sephia.
Something's wrong with world. :
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