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      04-18-2016, 09:02 PM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stylinexpat View Post
The new M2 seems good on a smaller track but on a track like the Nurburgring the numbers are not all that great (sort of like the 1/4 mile traps speed numbers).
What would be a satisfactory M2 Nurburgring time for you?
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      04-18-2016, 09:05 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rich8566 View Post
Why am I hearing the squeal of non-OEM track pads? If that's the case this time is not a legitimate time for what is supposedly an OEM car.
M performance pads.

For a car that goes to journalists and is flogged for hours on end, they are somewhat needed. Stock pads would be toast in no time and they would be swapping pads every few hours. Besides, no one in their right mind takes any M car (other than one with ceramics) to the track on street pads. They are street pads for a reason.

It doesn't invalidate anything IMO as it is simply a few hundred dollars for a BMW M performance item... no different than opting for ceramic brakes on an M3/4. If you took the M2 out on street pads for a 15 minute lapping session, the street pads would be fine but they cannot withstand hours of track abuse... no street pad can on any car. It doesn't change the capability of the brakes but simply the heat resistance of the pad.

Bet you EVERY 'Ring time is with some sort of track brake pad if for no other reason than safety of the driver to avoid a very dangerous potential scenario.
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      04-18-2016, 09:07 PM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gthal
Quote:
Originally Posted by rich8566 View Post
Why am I hearing the squeal of non-OEM track pads? If that's the case this time is not a legitimate time for what is supposedly an OEM car.
M performance pads.

For a car that goes to journalists and is flogged for hours on end, they are somewhat needed. Stock pads would be toast in no time and they would be swapping pads every few hours. Besides, no one in their right mind takes any M car (other than one with ceramics) to the track on street pads. They are street pads for a reason.

It doesn't invalidate anything IMO.
I agree, it does not invalidate the time, but the time cannot be compared to an OEM M2.
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      04-18-2016, 09:12 PM   #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rich8566 View Post
I agree, it does not invalidate the time, but the time cannot be compared to an OEM M2.
Don't know if I completely agree...

Take an M2 from the showroom out to Hockenheim, run a warm up lap and then a hot lap. An OEM pad would handle that without issue and without meaningful fade. The lap time would likely be similar, if not identical. It is the endurance of the pad over multiple and sustained laps that is the problem. The pad isn't, IMO, defining the ability of the car for a lap but the ability to sustain that over many laps.

Second, no one takes any M car to the track with street pads if they have any level of ability. Therefore, every M car (and every track car) is on a similar footing at the track as they all have track pads once you pass the level of a novice driver.
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      04-18-2016, 09:26 PM   #93
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Originally Posted by gthal View Post
Therefore, every M car (and every track car) is on a similar footing at the track as they all have track pads once you pass the level of a novice driver.
Yep. Now watch what happens when the production version of the Civic Type R actually runs the Nurburgring. The difference won't come down to the brake pads.
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      04-18-2016, 09:39 PM   #94
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Yes, it has been documented that BMW performance pads (available at the time) are used in all of the Nurburgring/Hockenheim/Instrumented testing by SportAuto. It is apples-to-apples, though improvements in brake compounds can occur over the years, but think anything from mid 2000s on is pretty comparable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gthal View Post
M performance pads.

For a car that goes to journalists and is flogged for hours on end, they are somewhat needed. Stock pads would be toast in no time and they would be swapping pads every few hours. Besides, no one in their right mind takes any M car (other than one with ceramics) to the track on street pads. They are street pads for a reason.

It doesn't invalidate anything IMO as it is simply a few hundred dollars for a BMW M performance item... no different than opting for ceramic brakes on an M3/4. If you took the M2 out on street pads for a 15 minute lapping session, the street pads would be fine but they cannot withstand hours of track abuse... no street pad can on any car. It doesn't change the capability of the brakes but simply the heat resistance of the pad.

Bet you EVERY 'Ring time is with some sort of track brake pad if for no other reason than safety of the driver to avoid a very dangerous potential scenario.
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      04-19-2016, 12:00 AM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rich8566 View Post
Why am I hearing the squeal of non-OEM track pads? If that's the case this time is not a legitimate time for what is supposedly an OEM car.
Those are OEM M Perf track brakepads and as already stated above apples to apples etc etc.

I'm using Pagid Yellow square setup atm and Castrol SRF fluid. If you're only one tiny bit into tracking your car you know that's the first thing to do...

Cheers
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      04-19-2016, 01:15 AM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin_NL View Post
Those are OEM M Perf track brakepads and as already stated above apples to apples etc etc.

I'm using Pagid Yellow square setup atm and Castrol SRF fluid. If you're only one tiny bit into tracking your car you know that's the first thing to do...

Cheers
Robin
Pagid yellows sound like a dump truck braking! Love it.

Nothing like pulling into a gas station with Pagids in and everyone looks at you like your car is about to explode from all the noise. They sure do last and brake hard though. They are the best that I've found.
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      04-20-2016, 03:12 PM   #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin_NL View Post
Apart from the budget(In my country an M2 is from 80k and a Cayman S from 90k to start with so that shouldn't be the biggest problem) , the M2 is 0.6s faster than a 981 Cayman S @ Hockenheim Short, and because of FR layout and more torque it can and will be more fun for many(like me), but I get what you're saying. I also think an M2 is 100 times more eyecandy than any Cayman except for GT4, sorry....

http://fastestlaps.com/tracks/hockenheim-short

Cheers
Robin
I can't wait to drive an M2, because I'll be evaluating it against the Cayman S. My experience has been that while the baby Porsches aren't the fastest cars around a course, their handling is incredible. The other thing about Porsches is that they stand up to track abuse incredibly well. I know a few of the SoFL guys with McLarens and Ferraris, and they all end up buying a 911 or Cayman for track duty because they're so much cheaper to run. Fewer breakages and lower maintenance costs.

That's where I'm hoping the M2 can slot in. It's quite a bit less expensive than the Cayman S, and (historically) BMW's tend to do pretty well at maintenance costs and low failure rate under track duty, provided you do the prep work. For the price difference between an M2 and a new Cayman S, you could do an entire brake upgrade, heh. The big question in my mind is cooling and turbocharger durability.
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      04-24-2016, 04:07 PM   #98
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Dropped "track soft" tires on the 1M in ProjectCARS and pulled off a 1:12.067 Nevermind my little off coming in to T2 lol. I love watching lap videos, then loading up pCARS to give it a try myself. Obviously there's a big difference between a video game and real life, but it's still a lot of fun. You can see how the racing line is similar. You can also see the celebratory burnout at the end is similar

Also, you'll notice that I'm cutting the track after Querspange. That's because this game doesn't have the Sport Auto short layout. It only has the short with chicane, so I just have to cut the track.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...1M-0112067.mp4
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      04-24-2016, 04:11 PM   #99
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lap 8 was all over the place.
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      04-24-2016, 06:39 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zenmaster View Post
lap 8 was all over the place.
Driver lost his mind
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