[MadBimmeRad]

Originally Posted by Lt1camaro

The ZF in my x3M is VERY slow. I've driven the g80 and it is noticeably slower than my e92 and f80 DCT. Let's not pretend they are as responsive and mechanical like a proper DCT. Because they aren't and take away from the soul of the car.
I agree, the ZF8 is a great transmission for every day driving. It doesn't compare to a DCT for engagement when pushed in the Twisties. BMW doesn't care because it's good enough for most people.

I'm baffled, if ZF8 is so terrible, why did they use it in the M4 CSL? Doesn't that sound a little illogical?

[TractionControlDelete]

Originally Posted by allinon72

Someone like Harris has a completely different perspective and outlook on car ownership than your average M2 owner, given his line of work. The fact is, the new M2 will destroy its predecessor on paper, but when you think about it, it's a drastically different car in many ways, so are they really comparable? Kind of like comparing a e92 to an f80.

Harris doesn't see the appeal behind the Miata which tells me a lot. He would later reevaluate his position and was still left unimpressed. That feedback was an excellent litmus test for his philosophy on cars. I think the Miata (NB especially) is amazing, so I take his reviews with the appropriate amount of salt for my tastes.

He's a cool guy but I view his opinions as purely entertainment.

[stefan]

I don't think any M car is worth "zilch". It's going to gain a lot of weight and ditch some M hallmarks like CF brace etc. All M cars are good. Well almost all. I'd be hanging onto that CS.

[gemini.m3]

Hmm, I can see both sides of the argument here and was at least somewhat part of the reason I sold my CS as one of the original few who had it from allocation. Guess what? I LOVE my m3, its refined, the interior is beautiful, love the ID7 colorful dash, etc... but boy do I miss that raw feeling I got in my CS, however for me the AWD 4 dr sedan was just a better choice long term with a baby.

The G87 M2C and (CS?) will no doubt be a great car, but with each generation we get closer to electrification and that awful ID8 is another step towards that which is why it looks so out of place on M cars, it won't have a manual E Brake and there is no way it'll look as good as the f87.

The F87 CS has a timeless design, unless Chris got a sneak peak, I don't see the G beating it and even if it did the car will be numb in comparison..

Grass isn't always greener fellas, I know a lot of you will be tempted to sell with the peak of the used car market and the m2c around the corner, but what you have in your garage is SPECIAL and no new iteration will change that.

[ellipsis212]

It's just so sad watching people walk away from the very cars they'll later yearn for. But, such is life.

And as long as BAT is around you can pay out the ass for your prior sins.

[TractionControlDelete]

Originally Posted by stefan

I don't think any M car is worth "zilch". It's going to gain a lot of weight and ditch some M hallmarks like CF brace etc. All M cars are good. Well almost all. I'd be hanging onto that CS.

This hits the nail on the head!! I say this as someone who owns the E46 M3, E92 M3, and F82 (sold the 99' E36 M3- that was a really big mistake because they are hard to find clean examples of now). I drive a M8 company car almost daily. Owned the M2 OG for about 5 days… then returned it to carmax and bought the E92 M3 above. And have tracked the G80 three times (Sonoma twice, and Laguna Seca once).

Every time the conversation about which one is best comes up I am really at a loss because they are all so good. The closest comparison I can really make is that it is like picking a favorite kid… I could never actually do so because my relationship is different and special with each one. All ///M cars are good. Period.

[Sublime00]

Someone post the article.

F**k apple news.

[robopp]

Originally Posted by Lt1camaro

The ZF in my x3M is VERY slow. I've driven the g80 and it is noticeably slower than my e92 and f80 DCT. Let's not pretend they are as responsive and mechanical like a proper DCT. Because they aren't and take away from the soul of the car.

If you're talking soul, manual is the only option. BMW's implementation of dual clutch has a lot to be desired. Probably why they did away with it.

[MachinesWithSouls]

I had an E92 M3 and I do miss it, but it's a much different car than a modern BMW. The other day I found myself asking if I would have put a V10 in the F90 I've been driving, revving to a million at every turn. I found myself saying no.

[Germanauto]

I love how this is such a throwback car forum thread. Bunch of us dudes shitting on car A vs. B.

[j23]

Originally Posted by JEM3

Spot on. This happens every single time.

First, G80 was ugly, now there is a 1 year wait if you want one.

Now, G87 is going to be "too heavy" and I guarantee you that someone going from a M2C into a G87 M2 wont be able to tell the difference.

Haha

This sums up 90% of folks on the forum. Hate, denial, admission, and purchase. The majority of those saying they won't get rid of their f87, will.

[MadBimmeRad]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

I love how this is such a throwback car forum thread. Bunch of us dudes shitting on car A vs. B.

Don't forget car C 😂😂

[MadBimmeRad]

Originally Posted by F82KPowers

This hits the nail on the head!! ....

Every time the conversation about which one is best comes up I am really at a loss because they are all so good. The closest comparison I can really make is that it is like picking a favorite kid… I could never actually do so because my relationship is different and special with each one. All ///M cars are good. Period.

You know something, that is the best, and most apt analogy I have ever heard.

I take my hat off to you; bravo

Having said that, I've decided to sell my M2CS with 950Km on the clock.

However, I won't list it until I have the perfect spiel for the ad - knowing me, it'll take 99 years to come up with that 🤣🤣

So expect to see the ad for sale of my car sometime closer to the end of the century .... And it'll start with:

Regrettable sale .....

[medphysdave]

I have some upcoming track days with my CS. Drive it like I stole it. . Agree with m card in general. Look at the prices. I've thought about trying to pick something up just for kicks. They all to expensive because they holding value. Its my kids that are holding me back. Those Rugrats are expensive.

[sergzz]

I don't know if it's just me but having a big widescreen tv where the gauges and a nav screen should be is probably the biggest deal breaker for me. Why can't they offer analog gauges as an option?
Even if it feels 'analog', looking at big tv is not an analog experience. I find myself turning the nav screen 90% of the time.

[Lt1camaro]

Originally Posted by MadBimmeRad

I'm baffled, if ZF8 is so terrible, why did they use it in the M4 CSL? Doesn't that sound a little illogical?

Why engineer a new transmission when you can reuse what's available. Business 101. Aside from mild suspension tweaks, what's mechanically different over a G82 non-CSL? They didn't even fit coilovers on the CSL this time around as compared to the previous GTS.

I owned both the M Specific ZF8 and a DCT BMW at the SAME time and they are not comparable in response or speed. Let's not try to argue they are. The choice for ZF8 is purely cost cutting across the BMW range rather than engineering a new DCT.

[supershaft]

a lot of copium going on in here for a car that hasn't been fully released or reviewed..

[buckybadger]

I have no doubt that the new M2, M2C and CS will be great cars.

Without a question, I want to bag one and also plan to keep the last DCT M2C which I currently own.

G87 series will provide a different experience, so does the M2C when compared to the E46 M3 and both are great drivers cars with the M characteristics.

So I won't be surprised to see the new G87 M2 come out as one of the best driver's car of all time (BMW engineers have the skills to do magic with the tuning of S58/ZF8, including the chassis). We can expect a even higher level of configurability. Comfort mode will be super comfy and sports+ will be hardcore, like you went back in time to the fatherland. In other words, the modern M2 G series will be more dynamic than ever!

[GoneIn4Secs]

some of you just have money, but dont appreciate a fine car

[Tecnniqe]

Very sad to see him in this mindset in regards to the F87CS, it's a glorious car

Life's too short to forever be chasing the next big thing and not enjoy what you have in that moment

[NYNick]

Originally Posted by MachinesWithSouls

I had an E92 M3 and I do miss it, but it's a much different car than a modern BMW. The other day I found myself asking if I would have put a V10 in the F90 I've been driving, revving to a million at every turn. I found myself saying no.

Man, that garage floor is cool.

[MachinesWithSouls]

Originally Posted by NYNick

Man, that garage floor is cool.

Thank you!