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BMW M2 Forum > BMW M2 Discussions > M2 transmission: do you prefer manual or M-DCT ?

View Poll Results: M2 transmission: do you prefer manual or double-clutch ?
Manual transmission 451 61.61%
M-DCT Drivelogic 281 38.39%
Voters: 732. You may not vote on this poll

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      09-28-2015, 03:41 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster View Post
Porsche enthusiasts have also rejected the idea of PDK. only.. .... so let's be clear.. the fat lady hasn't sung yet. :
if you like DCT.. go right ahead.. but don't try to push manual transmissions out the door..
One of the two is able to be repaired by the owner... the other.. not so much..
Hm, Porsche must have studied the 1M business case: let's get the smaller car some big brother goodies, set an attractive value-for-money price, make it manual only to avoid threatening the donor and we'll market the manual only choice as an oldskool benefit: hello 2015 Cayman GT4 + Boxster Spyder.

And look what the Porsche GT boss Andreas Preuninger stated during a presentation on Sep 27, 2015 ?
  • the overwhelming demand for the GT4 was rather underestimated by Porsche; worldwide GT4 production was initially scheduled for 1,600 cars, but now got ramped up to 2,500 - 3,000 (until next gen);
  • the success of the GT4 in a manual version has helped make the case that there is a market demand for that type of transmission in the Porsche GT product line;
  • no PDK version of the 981 gen Cayman GT4; the current GT4 is scheduled to continue for the duration of at least MY2016;
  • the next base GT3 might as well get a manual transmission as an alternative (option) to PDK;
  • no manual offered on any future version GT3 RS; Porsche considers the GT3 RS to be a track-oriented product whose mission is best served with a PDK transmission;
  • no 981 gen GT4 RS, due to constraints in engineering demands;
  • GT2 will happen;
  • natural aspirated engines will continue for all GT3 and GT4 products into the foreseeable future.
Interesting. Save the manuals !
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      09-28-2015, 04:34 PM   #24
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6mt

Auto in a sports car is offensive.
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      09-28-2015, 06:24 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artemis
Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster View Post
Porsche enthusiasts have also rejected the idea of PDK. only.. .... so let's be clear.. the fat lady hasn't sung yet. :
if you like DCT.. go right ahead.. but don't try to push manual transmissions out the door..
One of the two is able to be repaired by the owner... the other.. not so much..
Hm, Porsche must have studied the 1M business case: let's get the smaller car some big brother goodies, set an attractive value-for-money price, make it manual only to avoid threatening the donor and we'll market the manual only choice as an oldskool benefit: hello 2015 Cayman GT4 + Boxster Spyder.

And look what the Porsche GT boss Andreas Preuninger stated during a presentation on Sep 27, 2015 ?
  • the overwhelming demand for the GT4 was rather underestimated by Porsche; worldwide GT4 production was initially scheduled for 1,600 cars, but now got ramped up to 2,500 - 3,000 (until next gen);
  • the success of the GT4 in a manual version has helped make the case that there is a market demand for that type of transmission in the Porsche GT product line;
  • no PDK version of the 981 gen Cayman GT4; the current GT4 is scheduled to continue for the duration of at least MY2016;
  • the next base GT3 might as well get a manual transmission as an alternative (option) to PDK;
  • no manual offered on any future version GT3 RS; Porsche considers the GT3 RS to be a track-oriented product whose mission is best served with a PDK transmission;
  • no 981 gen GT4 RS, due to constraints in engineering demands;
  • GT2 will happen;
  • natural aspirated engines will continue for all GT3 and GT4 products into the foreseeable future.
Interesting. Save the manuals !
Lol. Yes.

But enthusiasts want to order it their way ! Subway and Burger King have the car buyer spoiled lol.
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      09-28-2015, 07:20 PM   #26
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If using for track day events, the DCT is preferable *for me* so that's what I would choose. Its faster, easier to focus on driving, and no chance of mis-shifting.

I find a proper Manual is more enjoyable for every day driving on public roads.
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      09-28-2015, 07:23 PM   #27
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I grew up on manual's but love new tech so nothing but love for DCT. I've had both on e92's. If the M2 adopts the f8x manual with rev matching I might go back to a manual. It's just a personal preference thing. Ideally, I'd take one of each and depending on my mood...
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      09-29-2015, 02:05 AM   #28
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I would take it with DCT - Manual only was one of the reasons I did not buy an 1M.
I drove stick for years... it's just not that fun anymore with todays traffic conditions.
+ DCT will be faster and it will make the car feel more "special" (at least to me).
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      09-29-2015, 04:02 AM   #29
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manual is so much more fun on the track

but sux in traffic
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      09-29-2015, 08:16 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beemer
manual is so much more fun on the track

but sux in traffic
I try to never drive my sports car in traffic. That's what a daily driver is for :-)
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      09-29-2015, 08:18 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John_01
If using for track day events, the DCT is preferable *for me* so that's what I would choose. Its faster, easier to focus on driving, and no chance of mis-shifting.

I find a proper Manual is more enjoyable for every day driving on public roads.
This is very sad to hear but it is indeed correct.

Anyone with a fear of mis shifting ..probably should order a DCT. Well, that or learn to drive hehehehe. \


EDIT: Never mind what I just said. I just remembered that I have seen an 2008 E90 M3 DCT motor failure on track... and the driver ( a very experienced solo driver) informed me it happened on the upshift ... it was a Massive blowup... fire out the back of the car while at COTA.. car was out of warranty period.

Last edited by M3 Adjuster; 09-29-2015 at 08:24 AM.. Reason: FORGOT that i have seen an M-DCT blow up on the track
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      09-29-2015, 08:33 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster View Post
Anyone with a fear of mis shifting ..probably should order a DCT. Well, that or learn to drive hehehehe.
Mis-shifting. Hm, that requires being half asleep. No, shifting in reverse and the car moving gently forward, is more likely ("Oops honey, that's 1st gear - you got to move the stick a bit further to the left"). Wouldn't be a bad thing for BMW to re-introduce the reverse beep sound - I liked it.

The day the warranty has expired, those with a DCT are gonna curse louder than those with an MT, due to the wallet-hurt if the transmission ever breaks down. A few left clicks too much...
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      09-29-2015, 01:14 PM   #33
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Manual for me, but I will try the auto in a 235i first to see how it is. In the uk the majority of cars have always been manual although there are probably more autos around now. Only time I drive an auto is hire cars abroad (it helps, what with steering wheel being on the other side like!)
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      09-29-2015, 01:50 PM   #34
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6MT all the way
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      09-29-2015, 02:01 PM   #35
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I prefer the sloppiness of a good ol' CVT! nothing says speed and performance like a CVT. If there's no carbon fibre CVT option, I'm refusing to buy!
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      09-29-2015, 03:47 PM   #36
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DCT, had fun driving a 6mt for eight years and that was enough... Everything that made MTs great in terms of performance has been invalidated, besides the anecdotal "feel and exp". Ideally, I'd go for an F1 clutch, which would be even sweeter, but I'd be willing to settle with decent DCT...

Similar analogue would be to forgo using a PC and keyboard, in favor of a typewriter because of the "experience and authenticity"... LOL
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      09-29-2015, 05:24 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabozo View Post
I think the M2 would be a awesome car in manual.

If it were a daily driver in a high traffic city....i would be forced to really consider a DCT. I can relate to those who would fall into this camp.
^^ This.

No question my preference for a track car is manual. It may not be as quick as Auto but the challenge in using it right is part of what it is all about. For a daily driver though has to be auto.

I traded a manual in on the M235i after 5 years of commuting in it, now have the auto. My track car is manual.
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      09-29-2015, 05:37 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrKevM5 View Post
It's going to be my track beast. DCT is an unfair advantage.

What does that even mean? Do you win your drivers schools?
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      09-29-2015, 06:03 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kanucks View Post
DCT, had fun driving a 6mt for eight years and that was enough... Everything that made MTs great in terms of performance has been invalidated, besides the anecdotal "feel and exp". Ideally, I'd go for an F1 clutch, which would be even sweeter, but I'd be willing to settle with decent DCT...
Similar analogue would be to forgo using a PC and keyboard, in favor of a typewriter because of the "experience and authenticity"... LOL
Allow me to repost an earlier post as reply to your typewriter analogy:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Artemis View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by nachob View Post
Same here. Have always had one manual and one auto in the stable. I even ran out and bought GTI with dual-clutch gearbox when it first came out, before BMW. Early adopter, but no many how many times I try to buy one, or drive auto loaner and test drive DCTs because that is the only thing available, it is not as fun for me as a manual. I also used to play guitar and I find the shifting a little like strumming a guitar and tapping my feet. It makes me feel connected to the machine in a way, the automatic doesn't. Even hitting the paddle, the shifts are so fast that they area out of rhythm but with a proper manual, you maintain the rhythm and it feels great.
We all know that it's a subjective, personal thing. Numerous, endless discussions about this topic at car forums.

True that it's nostalgia related, as technology inevitably evolves, improving situations.

But there is that peculiar physical and psychological aspect: rowing through gears with an MT feels more like as if the stick is an extension of your arm (and actually it is). Foot and arm operating in close harmony, as if you could touch - and stay in control over - the mechanics mounted onto the chassis. Getting you a little closer to experiencing the car's pulse (movements, bumps, clicks, vibrations, etc.). As a matter of fact, you got a more direct contact with the machinery - less 'sterile' compared to 'sending a message' to the machinery with a mini-moment paddle click or by delegating the whole shifting job to the robot for comfort purposes. And I don't mind that we can never match the speed, shifting perfection and consistency of the robot. No prizes to win. I consider it a benefit that one got to 'work' the machinery, that it requires more involvement. Though I fully understand that others will reply that AUTO/DCT is way more comfortable to operate.

Actually, I don't mind hearing someone gasping for breath when (s)he's singing a song or playing an instrument. I don't mind the artist and audience generating additional sounds that do not feature on the music score. To some extent all those additional sounds (noise?) could be edited out of the recording to achieve a more 'pure' sound, but I don't like that. For, often natural sounds feel more recognizable, more comfortable to connect to.

On the other hand, I do not mind embracing technology. If we adopt the same idea set out above to all sorts of assistance (warnings, DSC nannies, ABS, hill hold, navigation, comfort access, light and rain sensors, cruise control, high beam assist, power/memory seats, etc.) one could consider that you should leave it all off or out (if possible) to have a more 'pure' driving experience. Paradoxically, I don't mind those things (gadgets and gimmicks ?) to be on board and active. But as regards transmission, I'm an old skool MT aficionado.
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      09-29-2015, 06:04 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jordantii
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrKevM5 View Post
It's going to be my track beast. DCT is an unfair advantage.

What does that even mean? Do you win your drivers schools?
WTF are you referring to? Winning driving schools?!
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      09-29-2015, 06:12 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrKevM5 View Post
WTF are you referring to? Winning driving schools?!
I guess that the message that he kindly tried to get across for you consisted of questioning whether you're a professional or semi-professional race pilot for whom every millisecond counts to win prizes in race competitions.
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      09-29-2015, 07:01 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artemis
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrKevM5 View Post
WTF are you referring to? Winning driving schools?!
I guess that the message that he kindly tried to get across for you consisted of questioning whether you're a professional or semi-professional race pilot for whom every millisecond counts to win prizes in race competitions.
Not sure how accurate your guess is, but speaking to your interpretation, I am not a professional or semi-professional race driver. But I have a decent background in amateur SCCA racing, and have served as an instructor for the BMW, Porsche, and Ferrari clubs for over 15 years. I have extensive experience with both transmission types. When driving aggressively on the track, the speed of the gear change is not as important as the lack of mis-shifts. One less thing to concentrate on. Allows better focus on corner entry and exit.
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      09-29-2015, 07:47 PM   #43
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Manual for me. I don't think there is a right or wrong answer to this (short) age old question. To each his (or her) own. I've had DCT transmissions and they are great in some ways and annoying in others. But yes, manual all the way this time. Thank you BMW for still offering the fun manual!
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      09-29-2015, 07:52 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrKevM5 View Post
Not sure how accurate your guess is, but speaking to your interpretation, I am not a professional or semi-professional race driver. But I have a decent background in amateur SCCA racing, and have served as an instructor for the BMW, Porsche, and Ferrari clubs for over 15 years. I have extensive experience with both transmission types. When driving aggressively on the track, the speed of the gear change is not as important as the lack of miss-shifts. One less thing to concentrate on. Allows better focus on corner entry and exit.
Interesting to learn the motivation why people prefer MT or DCT. Some track aficionados prefer DCT for the comfort of speedy shifting and avoiding mis-shifting. Others prefer MT on track because they consider it more pure to work the transmission themselves (avoiding to mis-shift being part of the experience). Those faced with regular city driving and tailbacks, prefer DCT for comfort purposes (not getting tired of working the pedals for stop-start-stop). Others prefer MT for the feeling of being physically and mentally more involved with, and connected to, the mechanics. Still others prefer MT as a matter of principle and nostalgia.
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