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      02-21-2020, 07:13 AM   #881
El Conquistador

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Originally Posted by A6bullet View Post
Damn that's a bold statement. What makes you say that?
Just messing with you, but never bonded with my M3, plus slow by today's standard.
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      02-21-2020, 08:41 AM   #882
First Lieutenant
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Lol... Can't believe this thread is 41 pages in...
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      02-21-2020, 05:35 PM   #883

Drives: 335i, 340i, m240i, M2C, m340i
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Originally Posted by A6bullet View Post
At the beginning of this thread I made a comment as to the 330's potential as the new M-lite car. I've seen a couple people make jokes on it and some people think about it and sort of agree.

I had an M2 and then I "downgraded" to a G20. I know both cars pretty well. I can feel the 330's bushings in the rear sub frame, I can feel that the suspension is sorted out more than the Fxx gen, the steering is much improved, lacking feel maybe a bit but I can feel the road through the steering wheel and that matters.

The car is bit more heavy than the M2, but these cars are not "track weapons", dont kid yourself. They are very capable commuter cars period. You want it to be a track weapon? You will most definitely need to spend some money to get it there.

On the road I am constantly and pleasantly surprised at how well the 330i handles the road. It sticks just as good as the M2 on FUN drives. It rotates on command, and while down on power I feel satisfaction in mashing the pedal and accelerating briskly to a semi legal speed. Its not as visceral as the M2, not as aggressive. You don't hear all the road noise or exhaust noise, which is s shame but a blessing at the same time. This is my daily and my road-trip car, having all that noise gets old after driving for a while.

As I write this I find that I miss the direct feeling of the M2, the sound of diff working in the back at low speeds, working the manual transmission and getting perfect shifts. But at the same time I dont miss the shitty interior that creaks if you look at it wrong. I dont miss the fake leather seats that seem like an after thought (if it were a true race car I would have loved some cloth seats). I value my money and for me the value of the M2 was in its marketing as "the back to form M car of days past". But they tried to make an M for today with Ideas of yesterday and the result was compromises everywhere. I love the idea of the M2, but on the flesh it was disappointing. It sort of good, but not great.

Maybe when they release the G87 we'll see what the new architecture brings. Maybe they'll improve all the faults of the car. Or maybe they'll give it a buck tooth grille, some ugly wheels and more power for all the badge snob posers here, so they can brag about their 0-100.

Just my 2 cents, let me know what you think.
Perfect comments. I especially agree with your comments on the M2. I had a M2C, and share the same thoughts on the daily drive behavior and after-thought interior.
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      02-21-2020, 05:35 PM   #884
Major General

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Originally Posted by HeartbreakerF80 View Post
Yeah, no. I’ve driven a G M340i and it is nowhere near my M3. The overall stiffness and responsiveness. The body roll. The power band. Two drastically different cars. Above all, the feeling is different. Steering is disconnected in the 40i and you can’t hear much outside the cabin. Which a lot of people like! And I understand that! But to say the M340i is anywhere near an M3 CS, Competition, or even a base, is insane.
My dealer called me to offer “a deal”, basically a pull ahead on my 2018 M3 and put me in a M340. As I stated before, I have tested the M340 and thought it was a nice vehicle. I also stated that this would be my last M not because I am not enjoying it (love every minute in it) but because I am not using it the way it is meant to be driven. It is begging to be pushed.
So, I’ve had the M340 for two days. Got to know it well and push it. Corner it. Do the city, hwy, slow, fast, etc. still think it is a great car, very fast and capable, big improvement over my previous F30 335i MSport, however...those that compare it to the F80 need to wake up. Not even close. Sound, rawness, handling, playfulness, controlled looseness, and so much more. Totally different character. They may be similarly fast, by that is where it ends...
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      02-21-2020, 05:35 PM   #885

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Originally Posted by NathObeaN View Post
Surprised by the amount of people supporting BMW on this thread... really guys? M is supposed to represent the sports side of the brand. Tuned for 'colourful' driving. Sacrificing comfort in favour of rawness. Ultimate fun. That visceral sensation of feeling the road at your fingertips. A 'hell with the luxuries'. It doesn't mean 'fast commuter'. Bit by bit, 'M' is losing its meaning. It doesn't just mean 'fast'. 'My m340i can out-drag X'... I don't care. A Tesla can out-drag most things on the planet, doesn't make it a sports car... does it? Yes, an M340i etc are quick cars, but they aren't designed to be sports cars. I've driven an M240i on track back-to-back against my M2 and it's not the same, at all.

I haven't got an issue with a 'performance' variant of standard cars, but why pretend they are M, they're not. This is just marketing fluff gone lazy. The irony is that diluting the brand like this simply makes it less special and less desirable. People like to aim high, even if they can't get it. People like to dream. People fantasise of 'Ferrari' because it means something. If Ferrari started making commuter cars that were fast, but not 'Ferrari', the brand would die and the enthusiasts would move to a more serious brand. Just take a look at how many M owners are shifting towards Porsche. Says it all really.
Who cares if they're an M?

"Tuned for 'colourful' driving."

Sure because that can't be done after the fact.

"Sacrificing comfort in favour of rawness"

Nope, go and tell Mclaren that (or even Jaguar).. Overly hard suspension isn't necessary..

The two issues you're going to have is weight, size and beatings. A track car is designed to take a good kicking and not bounce around like jello because it's a boat on wheels. That costs money (a lot) in light yet strong materials, R&D and upgraded parts like ceramic brakes etc.

Seen as the M3 weighs 1621 KG's and the M140i (1525KG) / M240i (1587KG) / M340i (1670KG) weigh about the same or worse.. We're not off to a good start on track day requirements.

The M3 is a road car that comes out of the factory with a better setup for track use, mods can fix the gap but everything factored in you might as well bought the M3. Well, if you care about warranties etc.

"If Ferrari started making commuter cars that were fast, but not 'Ferrari'"

Ferrari make a "performance" SUV's don't they?

Anyway, when it comes to modern BMW's my perception is that of upgrades not highly designed specifically focussed vehicles. An M3 isn't an Ariel Atom, Zonda or even a Lotus, so again in my view an M3 is just the next leg up from the M340i.. Call the M3 an M350i for all I care..

It's a matter of preference, not branding.

P.S Not saying the M3 / 4 are bad cars, more multi-purposed which is a good thing.
P.P.S The M brand still retains desirability amongst car nuts at least.
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