[look585]

Let's talk tires.

Tires as we all know is the X-factor.

You can have the best chassis, suspension etc....

but the tires can make or break everything.

Preferences, experiences, please.

Let's go.

[zanchee]

RE-71RS Easy…

[ThreeStripes]

Anything for a novice. 660 or RE71RS if you’re looking for pace. RS4 if you’re not.

[look585]

Interesting

I just put on Cup 2s and call it a day.

I might be exploring these above options

[fleetfoot]

I started tracking on PS4S and liked those, but the shoulders wear quickly even with aggressive camber settings.

I’ve been on RS4s for 8 months now, but haven’t been super happy with them. They don’t seem much grippier than the PS4S, and they have a very vague feeling. They’re also pretty disappointing on the street with zero cold traction and kinda sketchy in heavy rain. They are wearing very well, but I had a bulge develop on the sidewall. When the shop took the tire off there was a 3’ piece of loose metal inside 😬. The guy next to me at the track last weekend also had a bulge develop in his RS4. Totally anecdotal, but seems suspect.

I’m hearing much better things about the Continental Extreme Contact Force, and I’m planning to switch ASAP. It’s supposed to be comparable grip and wear to the RS4, but much better steering feel.

Check out this TireRack comparison test:
https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests...y.jsp?ttid=302

[ThreeStripes]

https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/ar...-buyers-guide/

[look585]

Originally Posted by fleetfoot

I started tracking on PS4S and liked those, but the shoulders wear quickly even with aggressive camber settings.

I’ve been on RS4s for 8 months now, but haven’t been super happy with them. They don’t seem much grippier than the PS4S, and they have a very vague feeling. They’re also pretty disappointing on the street with zero cold traction and kinda sketchy in heavy rain. They are wearing very well, but I had a bulge develop on the sidewall. When the shop took the tire off there was a 3’ piece of loose metal inside ��. The guy next to me at the track last weekend also had a bulge develop in his RS4. Totally anecdotal, but seems suspect.

I’m hearing much better things about the Continental Extreme Contact Force, and I’m planning to switch ASAP. It’s supposed to be comparable grip and wear to the RS4, but much better steering feel.


Check out this TireRack comparison test:
https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests...y.jsp?ttid=302

Originally Posted by ThreeStripes

https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/ar...-buyers-guide/

My buddy just got these CECF tires. He loves them but does not track anymore.

Thank you for this.

My buddy was running NT01 and has high praise for them.
Anyone else with NT01 experience?

[OG Shark]

NT01 is an excellent tire as long as you understand it is really not very fast. What it has though is solid wear, very user friendly breakaway and recovery characteristics, and extremely consistent pace from day one all the way through until they are corded. The cheater 200s are faster. I adore this tire though for what it is and love it as a learning tool. It is a good step before the cheater 200s (or faster) to make quick progression to being able to maximize the tire. I would absolutely track them over the SC2 - better in every way (except available sizes depending on your fitment need - that is the only benefit of the SC2 imo).

[OG Shark]

Originally Posted by fleetfoot

I started tracking on PS4S and liked those, but the shoulders wear quickly even with aggressive camber settings.

I’ve been on RS4s for 8 months now, but haven’t been super happy with them. They don’t seem much grippier than the PS4S, and they have a very vague feeling. They’re also pretty disappointing on the street with zero cold traction and kinda sketchy in heavy rain. They are wearing very well, but I had a bulge develop on the sidewall. When the shop took the tire off there was a 3’ piece of loose metal inside 😬. The guy next to me at the track last weekend also had a bulge develop in his RS4. Totally anecdotal, but seems suspect.

I’m hearing much better things about the Continental Extreme Contact Force, and I’m planning to switch ASAP. It’s supposed to be comparable grip and wear to the RS4, but much better steering feel.

Check out this TireRack comparison test:
https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests...y.jsp?ttid=302

I loathe the RS4... If you are in need of a new set soon I would also consider Dunlop Direzza III's. I much prefer them of the RS4. Breakaway and recovery is friendlier, still solid wear rate, and pretty decent wet and dry grip. They are an excellent learning tool. This was the first tire I tracked and ran it until I was 100% comfortable full DSC off being able to maximize the available grip. Downside is I think they are phasing them out but good sizes are still available. I can't speak to the Contis haven't tried them so I can't compare those two - more just fyi on another possible option.

[dvas]

I think the answer to "What is the best track day tire?" is more nuanced than just RE-71RS.


Do you have an unlimited budget and don't care about heat cycles or wet weather driving? Hoosiers, or better yet, Michelin or Pirelli slicks like the ones used in the pro level are the way to go.

Do you do time attack where you can go easy on the tires and set yourself up for a single lap at all out pace? Than perhaps the cheater 200s are for you as you don't care about consistency over 20 minutes.

Endurance racing or even HPDE where you care about consistency over a 20 minute or longer session? NT01s are probably as good as any.

Do you want a tire that can drive you to the track and on the track whether it's rain or shine, or 40 degrees out? PS4S is hard to beat.


I mostly drive HPDEs with an occasional time attack so consistency is my main factor. So I run NT01s as do many of the other instructors with BMW, PCA, FCA, etc. in my area. I've tried the original Pilot Super Sports and SC2s and found NT01s to be faster over a given lap, more consistent for the entire session, and last twice to three times as many days. I've also run with the original RE71R (Not to be confused with the newer RS) and had identical best laps with the NT01s. The RE71R offered crisper steering feedback and great grip but would overheat within two laps and were finicky with pressures. The NT01s can be a bit dull feeling but they are grippy and extremely consistent, getting faster all the way to the chords. And I typically get 7 or 8 days out of them. They are also amongst the cheapest tires in this category. Nevertheless, I understand they are old tech and would love to find something that fits my needs better. I may try the new RE71RS or the GY SC3Rs next time around.


I appreciate the thought out Grassroots analysis but their rating and comment on the NT01s perplexes me. They say:

"delivers on par with today’s Super-200s for single-lap pace. But it can repeat that trick lap after lap, session after session—all the way to the cords"

which I agree with. But then they give the NT01s a C in pace and a D in heat tolerance which seems contradictory. In fact, I remember a previous version of the table where the NT01s were given higher ratings, so I wonder if this was a mistake.

[ThreeStripes]

Wheel specs and running square vs staggered drastically impacts your tire selection and factors into all this as well.

[Elganja]

I've been very happy with my 255/275 RE71RS setup on 19s. I got 10 days on track with my first set. Hopefully this 2nd set lasts as long!

[CSBM5]

It's astounding how long the NT-01 has lasted. I put a set on my E39 M5 track/autox wheels (square setup, 9.5" with 275/35) in early 2007, and it had been on the market a while already. Sadly the BFG R1 and R1S was never updated and apparently is headed to extinction; similar situation with the BFG Rival and Rival S/1.5 etc. The R1 was a great track tire that stuck and wore well...a good bit faster than the NT-01. It was tough enough to drive on the street for short distances as long as it was dry also.

[jwr9152]

I haven't really taken to the RE71RS. Was a huge fan on the original RE71R. The RE71RS is fantastic in the damp, and would absolutely be my tire of choise for that. It's also really fast for a lap, but drops off fairly quickly. It heats up really quickly and is good to go from the time you leave the pits, but over heats pretty quickly. Maybe better choice for cooler weather. The Nankang CRS doesn't heat up as quick, but is more consistent for a longer periord of time, and wears much better than the RE71RS. The Falken RT660 gets up to temperature quickly, like the RE71RS, but is able to run consistent laps, lap after lap. Some of my PB's have come at the end of happy hour. They wear better than the RE71RS, but not as good as the CRS. I do run the pressures on the RT660 about 5 psi higher than the other tires. The Goodyear SC3 is probably a tick slower than the others. Comparable lap times to the old RE71R. They wear very well and are fairly consistent over a session. The Goodyear SC3R is a fantastic tire. Ton of grip and confidence with that tire. They don't wear as good as the SC3, but what a great tire while you have grip. Michelin SC2 is good for going to the grocery store. Grip is ok when they are brand new, but goes off fairly quickly. They wear good, and I tend to heat cycle them out. Not a fan for the track. Deopends on your usage, but for time trials, where you need 200 tw tires I would run Nankangs in the heat, RE71RS in the wet or cold. To set fast lap times with a tire I can drive to the track I would go with the Goodyear SC3R. If I wanted a quick but durable tire for street and track I would go with the Falken RT660 or slightly slower, but more durable Goodyear SC3. Haven't tried the NT-01s

[ggggbmw]

One thing that people haven't talked about is cost. I've used the Hankook RS4 for several years because they last. (On a different car.) Yeah, other tires are better/faster, but RS4 is good enough for general lapping, and they are relatively cheap. With the wear and the price, costs are way lower RE71RS, AD09, ECF, or SC3/SC3R. M2guru has some specs in a thread saying he is getting great life and good cost ratio from his RE71RS. But he's often on slicks, and I'm wondering about his use case.

This year I decided to try something different. Kumho ECSTA V730's. They get decent reviews, and they are CHEAP. A good 20-30% less than the common suggestions. I have no idea how well they will work or how long they will last, but I thought they were worth a try.

Took them out for a quick test spin on some on-ramps tonight, and they certainly stick. Better than my PS4S street tires. First track weekend is 5/31. We'll see how they really do then.

I got them in a 265/35 R18 size, mounted on BW TR5A 18x10 ET33 w 5mm spacer in the front. Still on stock OEM suspension, so wanted something a bit narrower to avoid rub since I don't have camber plates yet. No issues on the test run tonight, so I think I chose well. Again, though, we'll see how they work out on the track for a final opinion.

[BackOnBlack]

Here is a very good comparison between Cup 2 and CR-S, very informative: