[Aust350z]

In the latest photos you can see the passenger side front splitter has partially broken off!!

[Racer20]

Originally Posted by akkando

Likely last NA gt4 and last NA Cayman and boxter, forever. It won't depreciate much, maybe it won't depreciate at all. So factor that in.

Don't be too sure of that . . . the GT4's engine is a new engine based on the 992 Carrera S engine, just without the turbo. It's NOT a GT3 engine detuned. That seems like a lot of development for a single run in a limited volume car.

Then there's the fact that the Cayman and Boxter twins are supposed to stick around until 2024 without a refresh, meaning there's lots of time for more iterations and maybe even a ".3" version. With Boxter/Cayman sales already at a low point, Porsche will HAVE to do something to maintain reasonable sales for the next 5 years.

Finally, the GT4 has cylinder deactivation, which I don't think they would include if this engine were purely intended for a single run GT variant. It's more likely a nod to ensure sufficient emissions performance to be used in a higher volume more street oriented 718 in a year or two. Something like a GT4 touring or even the 718.2 S or GTS.

Finally, there are a few articles like this out there from earlier this year, as well as some spyshots of boxter/cayman with the exhaust from the GT4 but normal GTS bodywork and suspension. This could be an engine mule, but it's more likely a test car for an upcoming iteration that hasn't been announced yet.

That said, the last GT4 has barely depreciated, so yeah, your main point still stands.

https://www.automobilemag.com/news/p...er-engine-gts/

[Racer20]

Originally Posted by RPM33

Can someone explain the benefits of adaptive suspension? Looks like an adaptive suspension button on the center console.

A well tuned adaptive suspension can be both more comfortable and have better handling than a passive suspension.

A regular shock absorber is only truly "optimized" for a narrow range of conditions (road surfaces, driver inputs, vehicle speeds, etc.) and everything else is a compromise.

Adaptive suspension adjusts the damping level based on what the driver is doing and what the suspension is doing.

So if you're driving straight down a rough road, the suspension can be soft for comfort, but when the driver turns the steering wheel the dampers stiffen up for improved response and handling. The different modes determine the priority that the system places on comfort vs. sportiness.

Adaptive suspensions are most capable in terms of keeping the body flat in turns and over uneven road surfaces. They are less capable of reacting to small sharp road impacts.

Most people think that sport+ means that all the sharp impacts should be stiffer or louder, but that's not typically the case. Usually the main difference will be the abruptness, pitch, and head-toss that the driver feels over undulating uneven roads.

Put another way, for an equal amount of body control and roll damping, a passive damper will typically have a far less smooth ride with more abrupt body motions.

Sharp impacts or small road events are typically handled by the passive portion of the damper and don't change much (intentionally) between modes. This leads some people to not feel a difference, but in reality they are looking for the wrong thing or not driving on roads where the difference is apparent.

The M2CS should be quite good, as it's basically the culmination of all the development that BMW has done on all the F chassis M cars, with the best hardware, in the smallest, lightest package. The adaptive suspension option should alleviate my concerns with ride quality, as that has been the main reason I haven't replaced my F80 with an M2C. A passive suspension as stiff as an M car will not be tolerable on the roads near me.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by dmboone25

Me too...until I saw the 100K starting price.

Also:

M2: 55 kg increase (3.68% extra):

• base M2 - 6MT (N55 3.0 engine): 1495 kg
• M2 Competition - 6MT (S55 3.0 engine): 1550 kg

GT4: 80 kg increase (5.97% extra):

• 981 GT4 (3.8 engine): 1340 kg
• 718 GT4 (4.0 engine): 1420 kg

If the same weighing parameters were applied: we can be sure that, with the new 4.0 engine, Porsche gave its best shot to limit the curb weight increase, but the engineers still ended with 80 kg extra on the table. Even the best car manufacturer in the world cannot do miracles.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by omasou

Picked up my 2020 M2 Competition yesterday and when I went to take the front license plate holder out of the trunk, I noticed this. Guess they'll both use the same front bumper. Hummmmm...

There has been a time that VINs of M2 Competition prototypes indicated "M2 CS" as model type. The S55 variant was supposed to be the "M2 CS". But apparently plans were changed due to tightened EU emissions regulations requiring the N55 engine to go extinct: exit N55 - exit "M2 CS" - enter "M2 Competition" - "M2 CS" model type got reserved for the 450hp variant.

[adc]

Originally Posted by akkando

Likely last NA gt4 and last NA Cayman and boxter, forever. It won't depreciate much, maybe it won't depreciate at all. So factor that in.

I think it depends on how much you drive it. A 20k miles or less Porsche GT car has no depreciation. A 50k mile one is down in price considerably, and if you pass 80k miles it drops off sharply.


Would you buy a GT3 or GT4 with 50k miles? Knowing it’s seen it all, from potholes and salty roads to the racetrack? You’d have to factor in all the maintenance costs that will hit sooner rather than later, and which are enormous on such a car.

[WAY]

Originally Posted by Zuzu

So glad I didn't trade up for the M2C, as I want this BAD and will be worth the wait.

I did, but there is always the option of trading up again haha.

[Brake_Late]

Bring it

[dmboone25]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Also:

M2: 55 kg increase (3.68% extra):

• base M2 - 6MT (N55 3.0 engine): 1495 kg
• M2 Competition - 6MT (S55 3.0 engine): 1550 kg

GT4: 80 kg increase (5.97% extra):

• 981 GT4 (3.8 engine): 1340 kg
• 718 GT4 (4.0 engine): 1420 kg

If the same weighing parameters were applied: we can be sure that, with the new 4.0 engine, Porsche gave its best shot to limit the curb weight increase, but the engineers still ended with 80 kg extra on the table. Even the best car manufacturer in the world cannot do miracles.

Still lighter than the OG M2.

But I get your point - where is all the extra weight coming from???

[akkando]

Originally Posted by Racer20

Don't be too sure of that . . . the GT4's engine is a new engine based on the 992 Carrera S engine, just without the turbo. It's NOT a GT3 engine detuned. That seems like a lot of development for a single run in a limited volume car.

Then there's the fact that the Cayman and Boxter twins are supposed to stick around until 2024 without a refresh, meaning there's lots of time for more iterations and maybe even a ".3" version. With Boxter/Cayman sales already at a low point, Porsche will HAVE to do something to maintain reasonable sales for the next 5 years.

Finally, the GT4 has cylinder deactivation, which I don't think they would include if this engine were purely intended for a single run GT variant. It's more likely a nod to ensure sufficient emissions performance to be used in a higher volume more street oriented 718 in a year or two. Something like a GT4 touring or even the 718.2 S or GTS.

Finally, there are a few articles like this out there from earlier this year, as well as some spyshots of boxter/cayman with the exhaust from the GT4 but normal GTS bodywork and suspension. This could be an engine mule, but it's more likely a test car for an upcoming iteration that hasn't been announced yet.

That said, the last GT4 has barely depreciated, so yeah, your main point still stands.

https://www.automobilemag.com/news/p...er-engine-gts/

That's a good point. Strange that they would develop a new NA engine if they didn't have additional plans for it.

[medphysdave]

No one seems to be mentioning it, but something looks odd about the rear quarter panels. I'm wondering if there are brake cooling vents built into the quarter panels. I first thought it was allusion from camo, but it doesn't look right.

[JCZ5]

Originally Posted by adc

I think it depends on how much you drive it. A 20k miles or less Porsche GT car has no depreciation. A 50k mile one is down in price considerably, and if you pass 80k miles it drops off sharply.


Would you buy a GT3 or GT4 with 50k miles? Knowing it’s seen it all, from potholes and salty roads to the racetrack? You’d have to factor in all the maintenance costs that will hit sooner rather than later, and which are enormous on such a car.

You brought up some very good points here. I was thinking of going for GT4 because, value retention...but what you said makes complete sense.

I plan to drive my vehicle on road trips, may be more sensible with the M2CS.

[brad850csi]

Originally Posted by mikeahso

Making do with the poverty M2C I'm afraid.

I like the plate Mine is BMW001, might see you around!

[hellrotm]

Originally Posted by AlpsRider

Yeah that 100k starting price for the 718 GT4 is just the beginning point for the price of that car. The M2 CS will be mostly fully loaded from the get go.

Porsche definitely will nickel and dime you for options. For comparison the options for the M4cs....Metallic paint-$550, Special order paint-$5200, Exec pack-$1650, Carbon ceramic brakes-$8150.

M2cs will add PDK-$2900(or manual as a no cost option).

Using some M2c config prices to estimate fully loaded M2cs. $58,900 +35% cs premium, +$550 met paint, +$1200 exec, +$8150 ceramic brakes, +$2900 pdk = $92,315

[hellrotm]

Originally Posted by Racer20

Don't be too sure of that . . . the GT4's engine is a new engine based on the 992 Carrera S engine, just without the turbo. It's NOT a GT3 engine detuned. That seems like a lot of development for a single run in a limited volume car.

Then there's the fact that the Cayman and Boxter twins are supposed to stick around until 2024 without a refresh, meaning there's lots of time for more iterations and maybe even a ".3" version. With Boxter/Cayman sales already at a low point, Porsche will HAVE to do something to maintain reasonable sales for the next 5 years.

Yup, this new engine is going into other models to spread the R&D cost. Just like that new manual transmission they developed for the 911 R. Everyone knew it was going to trickle down.

$99k msrp for GT4 leaves a lot of room between the $80k GTS. There are those Cayman 6 and Boxster 6 rumors.

Supposedly this is running around. A base looking 718 Cayman with new GT4 exhaust and a 6 cylinder exhaust note.

[blefevre]

Originally Posted by dmboone25

Still lighter than the OG M2.

But I get your point - where is all the extra weight coming from???

Actual weight increase is only ~30kg when comparing apples to apples build. There are new EU regulations (guidelines?) that Porsche is now following. It means listed weight must be an 'average' build somewhere along the lines of what >33% of people will buy. That means the weight likely doesn't include things like CCB, LWBS, radio delete, etc. Andreas Preuninger said this in an interview on the 718 GT4 and provided the 30kg number. So still a weight increase, but not as bad as the numbers suggest.

[CosmosMpower]

Originally Posted by dmboone25

Really good point - AND there will be market adjustments...I am guessing this car will be going for 140-150 if you want one early...

LOL, no it won't. There was never a 40-50k ADM on the original GT4. Maybe a GT2RS. Markup might be 10-15k tops but I bet you'll be able to get one for MSRP pretty quickly since the specs aren't very good.

[M2Cmtl]

The first GT4 was limited production. Porsche have already said they will make as many GT4 as people want this time around so you would be an idiot to pay a mark up...

[Jason]

[Brake_Late]

I'm so glad that BMW found a way to off all of the extra parts made for the F8x platform. CCBs,,Seats , S55s, and DCTs for starters.
Good plan at the end of production for F series.

[Miko M]

Originally Posted by Brake_Late

I'm so glad that BMW found a way to off all of the extra parts made for the F8x platform. CCBs,,Seats , S55s, and DCTs for starters.
Good plan at the end of production for F series.

Yes it is
Lately I am thinking instead of waiting for G80 I should see if I can find one off this bad boys for track.
Not sure if I can get one

[///M TOWN]

Originally Posted by dmboone25

Me too...until I saw the 100K starting price.

And that's with nothing optional.

😜