Down shifting to 1st gear

D CHOI · 03-11-2018, 12:19 AM

Anyone have the habit of down shifting to 1st gear esp when coming up to a stop light? I heard it's bad for the synchros but sometimes I can't help myself to hear the burbles and the backfire if you downshift hard enough.

ORIGIN M. · 03-11-2018, 01:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D CHOI

Anyone have the habit of down shifting to 1st gear esp when coming up to a stop light? I heard it's bad for the synchros but sometimes I can't help myself to hear the burbles and the backfire if you downshift hard enough.

2nd is low enough.

jmh600cbr · 03-11-2018, 06:13 AM

I get more burble going from 4 to 3 than from 2 to 1. Keep the car reviving high for good sound. Never put the car in first until you're completely stopped.

swagon · 03-11-2018, 06:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D CHOI

Anyone have the habit of down shifting to 1st gear esp when coming up to a stop light? I heard it's bad for the synchros but sometimes I can't help myself to hear the burbles and the backfire if you downshift hard enough.

That's a total fuckboi move right there.

PackPride85 · 03-11-2018, 06:45 AM

Yes its bad on the synchros. Especially in this car where the difference in ratio between first and second gears are massive.

Artemis · 03-11-2018, 06:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D CHOI

Anyone have the habit of down shifting to 1st gear esp when coming up to a stop light? I heard it's bad for the synchros but sometimes I can't help myself to hear the burbles and the backfire if you downshift hard enough.

https://www.carthrottle.com/post/thi...to-first-gear/ ("This Is Why It's Difficult To Downshift Into First Gear")

Ian ///M · 03-11-2018, 07:14 AM

doesn’t rev match negate this?

Bt12 · 03-11-2018, 07:38 AM

Rarely downshift to 1. Maybe to 3rd. But when I engine break hard, I tend to also feather the brakes at the same time so by the time I’m 3rd and slowing the brakes are doing a large portion of job.

babym2 · 03-11-2018, 10:47 AM

What about if I am rolling about 4-5mph in neutral and I need to get going again, downshifting to 2nd the engine doesnt seem to like it and you have to slip the clutch a bit, so I downshift to 1st and rev match, car seems to like this better

M3 Alex · 03-11-2018, 03:56 PM

Sounds like a first-time MT driver kind of thing to do. All of my old cars wouldn't even let you get into first if you were rolling (even just 2mph or something), without a harsh grind and a lot of force. I don't even start from stop signs in 1st if I am still rolling slightly (1-5mph).

AndrewC1989 · 03-11-2018, 04:36 PM

IMO downshifting into first should only be done if you need to slow the car down as soon as humanly possible in some kind of emergency situation where you're already braking and see you won't be able to stop in time.

I wouldn't be doing it on a regular basis just for some added noise.

e92ben · 03-11-2018, 04:37 PM

Questions like this make me never want to buy second hand M cars lol

eatingpizzainthef87rules · 03-11-2018, 05:39 PM

Modern syncros can handle a downshift to first without issue - the M box will have no issues popping into first at 5-10mph with a proper rev match, not 1995 anymore. Just don’t force it in or do it much above 3500rpm into first or the delta will be too high.

Source - have rebuilt 2 f80 boxes first hand.

D CHOI · 03-11-2018, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M2 Alex

Sounds like a first-time MT driver kind of thing to do. All of my old cars wouldn't even let you get into first if you were rolling (even just 2mph or something), without a harsh grind and a lot of force. I don't even start from stop signs in 1st if I am still rolling slightly (1-5mph).

My 1st car is also a MT I had for 10 years+ and I never downshift to first as it's not an easy thing to do. However with the help of rev match in the M2 it shifts perfectly every time and I was hoping it's not as bad vs with no auto rev match.

M3 Alex · 03-11-2018, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D CHOI

Quote:

Originally Posted by M2 Alex

Sounds like a first-time MT driver kind of thing to do. All of my old cars wouldn't even let you get into first if you were rolling (even just 2mph or something), without a harsh grind and a lot of force. I don't even start from stop signs in 1st if I am still rolling slightly (1-5mph).

My 1st car is also a MT I had for 10 years+ and I never downshift to first as it's not an easy thing to do. However with the help of rev match in the M2 it shifts perfectly every time and my thinking is it's not as bad vs with no auto rev match.

Fair point. I've honestly never tried. Old habits die hard.

chief1richard · 03-11-2018, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by D CHOI

Anyone have the habit of down shifting to 1st gear esp when coming up to a stop light? I heard it's bad for the synchros but sometimes I can't help myself to hear the burbles and the backfire if you downshift hard enough.

Been driving standard transmissions for over 50 years, and I almost always down shift all gears, have never once had any problems with my transmission or clutch. One car was an 87 Saab 900 with over 300,000 miles. Enjoy your vehicle, its a well made machine.

ORIGIN M. · 03-11-2018, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chief1richard

Quote:

Originally Posted by D CHOI

Anyone have the habit of down shifting to 1st gear esp when coming up to a stop light? I heard it's bad for the synchros but sometimes I can't help myself to hear the burbles and the backfire if you downshift hard enough.

Been driving standard transmissions for over 50 years, and I almost always down shift all gears, have never once had any problems with my transmission or clutch. One car was an 87 Saab 900 with over 300,000 miles. Enjoy your vehicle, its a well made machine.

Your experience is no doubt time dated but not everyone is truly gifted in the art of shifting their transmission correctly.

chief1richard · 03-11-2018, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ORIGIN M.

Your experience is no doubt time dated but not everyone is truly gifted in the art of shifting their transmission correctly.

True, having driven trucks for a living, downshifting isn't something to make your exhaust sound cool. It is a necessity.

ORIGIN M. · 03-11-2018, 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chief1richard

Quote:

Originally Posted by ORIGIN M.

Your experience is no doubt time dated but not everyone is truly gifted in the art of shifting their transmission correctly.

True, having driven trucks for a living, downshifting isn't something to make your exhaust sound cool. It is a necessity.

Absolutely

m34m · 03-11-2018, 10:57 PM

Downshifting the M2 with MT and auto rev match works like butter even into first gear. I've done it but certainly don't make it a habit. Why take the chance?

MrKepan · 03-12-2018, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by m34m

Downshifting the M2 with MT and auto rev match works like butter even into first gear. I've done it but certainly don't make it a habit. Why take the chance?

Quote:

Originally Posted by m34m

Downshifting the M2 with MT and auto rev match works like butter even into first gear. I've done it but certainly don't make it a habit. Why take the chance?

Even with rev match, downshifting to 1st at very low speed usually causes my diff to clunk. Very unpleasant.

sh_kross · 03-12-2018, 08:58 AM

Very interesting topic. It would be great if there was a better reference for these type of information when approaching the task of learning to drive a manual transmission. It's rather disappointing that it seems that the only way to learn to drive one properly is to be taught by someone else or do a LOT of searching and watching videos. I wish there was a common place to look up reliable information for driving manual or even auto for that matter.

03-11-2018, 12:19 AM	#1
D CHOI Captain 593 Rep 845 Posts Drives: 2017 BMW M2 Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Las Vegas iTrader: (0)	Down shifting to 1st gear Anyone have the habit of down shifting to 1st gear esp when coming up to a stop light? I heard it's bad for the synchros but sometimes I can't help myself to hear the burbles and the backfire if you downshift hard enough.
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03-11-2018, 06:13 AM	#3
jmh600cbr Lieutenant 275 Rep 445 Posts Drives: G80 Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Toronto iTrader: (0) Garage List 2021 BMW G80 [0.00]	I get more burble going from 4 to 3 than from 2 to 1. Keep the car reviving high for good sound. Never put the car in first until you're completely stopped. __________________ 2018 F87 LCI gone but not forgotten 2021 G80 6MT BSM
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03-11-2018, 06:45 AM	#5
PackPride85 Lieutenant Colonel 1135 Rep 1,651 Posts Drives: M2 Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: NC iTrader: (0)	Yes its bad on the synchros. Especially in this car where the difference in ratio between first and second gears are massive.
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03-11-2018, 07:14 AM	#7
Ian ///M Captain 493 Rep 656 Posts Drives: '17 AW M2 (DCT) Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: VA iTrader: (0)	doesn’t rev match negate this?
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03-11-2018, 07:38 AM	#8
Bt12 Captain 393 Rep 960 Posts Drives: 2018 X5,2018 m2, 2018 x1 Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: Bicoastal iTrader: (0)	Rarely downshift to 1. Maybe to 3rd. But when I engine break hard, I tend to also feather the brakes at the same time so by the time I’m 3rd and slowing the brakes are doing a large portion of job.
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03-11-2018, 10:47 AM	#9
babym2 Private First Class 61 Rep 130 Posts Drives: 18 M2 6MT Join Date: Mar 2018 Location: AZ iTrader: (0)	What about if I am rolling about 4-5mph in neutral and I need to get going again, downshifting to 2nd the engine doesnt seem to like it and you have to slip the clutch a bit, so I downshift to 1st and rev match, car seems to like this better
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03-11-2018, 03:56 PM	#10
M3 Alex Private First Class 301 Rep 131 Posts Drives: '26 M3C xDrive Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: New York iTrader: (0)	Sounds like a first-time MT driver kind of thing to do. All of my old cars wouldn't even let you get into first if you were rolling (even just 2mph or something), without a harsh grind and a lot of force. I don't even start from stop signs in 1st if I am still rolling slightly (1-5mph).
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03-11-2018, 04:36 PM	#11
AndrewC1989 Brigadier General 11292 Rep 4,623 Posts Drives: 2015 328d xDrive Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: NoVA iTrader: (5) Garage List 2015 328d xDrive [8.01]	IMO downshifting into first should only be done if you need to slow the car down as soon as humanly possible in some kind of emergency situation where you're already braking and see you won't be able to stop in time. I wouldn't be doing it on a regular basis just for some added noise.
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03-11-2018, 04:37 PM	#12
e92ben Brigadier General 1108 Rep 3,253 Posts Drives: BMW M3 BMW 635csi Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Kenosha Wi iTrader: (8)	Questions like this make me never want to buy second hand M cars lol __________________ e92 ///M3
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03-11-2018, 05:39 PM	#13
eatingpizzainthef87rules Second Lieutenant 254 Rep 221 Posts Drives: M2 Join Date: Mar 2018 Location: Toronto iTrader: (0)	Modern syncros can handle a downshift to first without issue - the M box will have no issues popping into first at 5-10mph with a proper rev match, not 1995 anymore. Just don’t force it in or do it much above 3500rpm into first or the delta will be too high. Source - have rebuilt 2 f80 boxes first hand.
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03-11-2018, 10:57 PM	#20
m34m Captain 692 Rep 665 Posts Drives: E90 Join Date: Mar 2015 Location: Canada iTrader: (0)	Downshifting the M2 with MT and auto rev match works like butter even into first gear. I've done it but certainly don't make it a habit. Why take the chance?
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03-12-2018, 08:58 AM	#22
sh_kross Private First Class 95 Rep 177 Posts Drives: Long Beach Blue M2 Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: Puerto Rico iTrader: (0) Garage List 2018 BMW M2 [10.00]	Very interesting topic. It would be great if there was a better reference for these type of information when approaching the task of learning to drive a manual transmission. It's rather disappointing that it seems that the only way to learn to drive one properly is to be taught by someone else or do a LOT of searching and watching videos. I wish there was a common place to look up reliable information for driving manual or even auto for that matter.
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