Quote:
Originally Posted by Wattens
No CEL for me and I've been running the Turbosmart Dual Port since last September with BMS Air Intake. Coming up to 6 months.
Turbosmart has two options, a full recirculating option, and a dual-port option which releases SOME of the air to atmosphere, I doubt it's releasing much, it makes a hard sound but that's probably due to the design to make the sound, rather than dumping heaps of air out of the system.
And of course there is turbo leak, have you played around with the stock Pierburg valve? The end of it that seals is a rigid floating plastic seal, the turbosmart product seals completely with billet and a rubber O-ring at the end to make a complete seal, and the metal piston sits recessed inside.
To me the evidence is clear that my stock DV was leaking boost even though I originally bought this for the noise. Turbosmart never sold this to me under the pretense of extra power, but the before and after dyno run showed increased max power and the turbo kicking in harder from 4,000rpm according to multiple dyno runs. The boost difference at 4,750 rpm was 12.7psi fairly costantly over and over on stock DV versus 13.5psi at the same RPM's over and over with the Turbosmart unit installed.
The lag is definitely 100% improved, the stock DV in my case was definitely leaking boost and I had no idea until the part was replaced with something better.
As I mentioned in my previous post, to me the after install throttle response is improved. I get what your saying about the dual-port losing some air and in theory, should be less responsive, but you do know in different driving modes the DV opens and closes at different times. What I've noticed is the valve opens and vents to atmosphere the most in MDM or comfort mode. In Sports+ the valves (stock or aftermarket) hardly open and when they do, it's closed quickly. I'm driving a DCT, maybe this is why I'm not noticing reduced throttle response and in fact seemingly improved throttle response probably because my boost curve has been brought forward?
I'd expect there to be a bigger difference with manual cars simply because of it taking longer to shift gears giving the BOV more time to vent. In DCT going up the gears and not releasing your foot for gear changes means the valve isn't having to open at all anyway. Maybe? I guess? I'm not an expert, I'm just applying some logic and actual first-hand experience to this thread.
The other thing is how much air is being lost from the system? Is it enough to cause a NOTICEABLE effect in turbo responsiveness? Maybe on a test rig it can be measured, maybe at F1 level where 1:100ths of a second count, but in reality how many people have actually noticed a drop in responsiveness from vent to atmosphere versus full recirculation? I never have and I've been playing with turbo cars since the mid-1990s, my first car was an R33 GTR. I've been through a lot of turbo cars and never once felt the difference between vent to atmosphere versus recirculation.
Theory is one thing, but it's what actually happens in real life that counts.
In theory, a 911 isn't meant to work very well, drive a GT3 and tell me the theory of an engine hanging out behind the rear axle is meant to be a bad thing?
I've written a lot, someone is going to find a flaw in what I've written. But the reality is, however it does it, and whatever the theory says about it, it works great in reality. With increased power, earlier boost, great vent to atmosphere sound, in my case improved (or worst case the same) throttle response, and when I'm done with it I can put it on eBay and get most of my money back. I'm just grinning ear to ear.
|
"To me the evidence is clear that my stock DV was leaking boost"
Do you mind sharing the evidence? There are tons of people running 18psi on the stock diverter valve with no issue.
"The boost difference at 4,750 rpm was 12.7psi fairly costantly over and over on stock DV versus 13.5psi at the same RPM's over and over with the Turbosmart unit installed."
I'm sorry, but this is impossible. The valve is controlled by the DME to release boost when the car is above target. A different valve will not make more boost. And if there was a leak, you would not see more boost either by swapping, as the DME will close the valve more to reach the target boost. If you do see more boost than the target, you will get an overboost CEL. The only way you'll see higher boost is with a tune to change the target.
"but you do know in different driving modes the DV opens and closes at different times. What I've noticed is the valve opens and vents to atmosphere the most in MDM or comfort mode. In Sports+ the valves (stock or aftermarket) hardly open and when they do, it's closed quickly"
So let's say different driving modes open and close the valve different. I agree it does that, less boost in comfort mode for less power. However, changing your valve is going to change how and when the DME open/closes the valve. Like I said above, there is a boost target the DME adheres to. Also, not sure if you were implying it or not, but with the dual port model, the DME does not decide how much gets vented to atmosphere and how much gets diverter back into the intake. It is a static rate at which both ports are open. I think it's 50/50 between them. Unless you wire in a separate control for each, but that isn't what is happening here.
"but in reality how many people have actually noticed a drop in responsiveness from vent to atmosphere versus full recirculation?"
Everyone?
https://www.google.com/search?q=vent...hrome&ie=UTF-8
"and when I'm done with it I can put it on eBay and get most of my money back. I'm just grinning ear to ear."
This point is moot because you're gonna spend more on labor swapping the part to sell on ebay than you will get for it.
"Theory is one thing, but it's what actually happens in real life that counts."
That's kind've a weird belief. It's the theory that makes people believe something will work before they attempt it. No one built an electric car without a theory it will work first.
Overall, seems like a bunch of snake oil you're pushing. Which is what I get every time I ask question about the TS product.
But really, the most important question is... What is the advantage to the TS valve over the cheaper GFB DV+? Let's say the plumb back works just as well as the GFB DV+, I'm not saying it doesn't, why should someone purchase it over the DV+?