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New Member
Drives: 11 458, 91M3, 986BoxS
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Houston, TX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jetbill
Quote:
Originally Posted by jakeg104
jetbill, this thread gives me hope!
I live in Houston, which should be known as having the worst roads in the US, might be a contender for the worst in the world when it comes to major Metropolitan areas.
Drove a M2, absolutely LOVED the car; the size, the look, the wheelbase. Felt a lot like the e30M3 that is playing daily driver currently, except for the way the car behaved over bad roads.
You confirmed my instincts, which is that the springs felt linear up front; the way the whole car would dive/dip into a bump vs the actual wheel articulating into the road...
It is literally the only thing keeping me from getting one. Getting beat up every day on the road isn't fun..
Researched quite a bit online, most folks recommend the Dinan setup to help ease the behavior, but that setup is still linear springs with manual adjustments (as you had said, time will be spent under the car, with panicked bystanders wondering if i got run over!). Not sure if this is the way to go, at least for me.
This hybrid setup of using a F8X M3 EDC damper with DSC Sport controller could be the solution. I looked into the company in earnest for my 997.2S, really seem to be passionate about what they do.
Car will spend 90% on Houston roads, 10% at the track (typically COTA), so priority will be on comfort and how the car can handle undulations on the road.
A few questions for you-
1. Ideally, for daily usage, i think front and rear Progressive springs will be the way to go. Do you know if the F8X M3 springs up front are progressive or linear? If they are progressive, do you know if they would fit in the M2?
2. Same for the rear F8X M3 springs. Do you know the spring rate and whether they are a bolt on to the M2? Assuming its progressive as well?
2. The rear spring rates for all the brands you tested seem really high. I remember many years ago setting up a e36M3 for track use, and we got Ground Control Coilovers with 450/650 spring rates and that rear felt like rock, with no give. Are all the manufacturers using higher spring rates in the rear due to the car's relative weight?
3. The MPS Suspension- Pictures of the system online 'seem' to suggest that the front springs are progressive (they usually are fatter in the middle, no?), so its interesting to see that your findings actually point to them being linear.
Thanks again for all the research you have done and for sharing this valuable info!
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Hi Jakeg, I've asked Racer20 to plug into this to help when he has some time, I'm far from a suspension engineer.
1/2: The M3/4 springs are close to the same rates , a bit less and linear front and rear. M2 rates are definitely higher up front. Not sure if spring rates would help in your situation, sounds like more of a byproduct of damper tuning / bump stops , tires...
3: Higher rear rates are a byproduct of wheel rates derived from the motion ratio, plus a small percentage to create "flat ride" and alleviate pitch front to rear.
4: I've seen linear springs look like progressive , barrel shaped etc. one other example of this might be Swift Spec R lowering springs.
Interesting about your track experience at COTA- first time out there about a few months ago attending the Carrera's of the America's and it was awesome. Quite a contrast to my home track (Sebring). I did run into a few individuals that were running DSC Sport in a few Porsche's. Ahhh the glazing over they're eyes when I told him about retrofitting the system into an M2. |
Quote:
Originally Posted by jetbill
Quote:
Originally Posted by jakeg104
jetbill, this thread gives me hope!
I live in Houston, which should be known as having the worst roads in the US, might be a contender for the worst in the world when it comes to major Metropolitan areas.
Drove a M2, absolutely LOVED the car; the size, the look, the wheelbase. Felt a lot like the e30M3 that is playing daily driver currently, except for the way the car behaved over bad roads.
You confirmed my instincts, which is that the springs felt linear up front; the way the whole car would dive/dip into a bump vs the actual wheel articulating into the road...
It is literally the only thing keeping me from getting one. Getting beat up every day on the road isn't fun..
Researched quite a bit online, most folks recommend the Dinan setup to help ease the behavior, but that setup is still linear springs with manual adjustments (as you had said, time will be spent under the car, with panicked bystanders wondering if i got run over!). Not sure if this is the way to go, at least for me.
This hybrid setup of using a F8X M3 EDC damper with DSC Sport controller could be the solution. I looked into the company in earnest for my 997.2S, really seem to be passionate about what they do.
Car will spend 90% on Houston roads, 10% at the track (typically COTA), so priority will be on comfort and how the car can handle undulations on the road.
A few questions for you-
1. Ideally, for daily usage, i think front and rear Progressive springs will be the way to go. Do you know if the F8X M3 springs up front are progressive or linear? If they are progressive, do you know if they would fit in the M2?
2. Same for the rear F8X M3 springs. Do you know the spring rate and whether they are a bolt on to the M2? Assuming its progressive as well?
2. The rear spring rates for all the brands you tested seem really high. I remember many years ago setting up a e36M3 for track use, and we got Ground Control Coilovers with 450/650 spring rates and that rear felt like rock, with no give. Are all the manufacturers using higher spring rates in the rear due to the car's relative weight?
3. The MPS Suspension- Pictures of the system online 'seem' to suggest that the front springs are progressive (they usually are fatter in the middle, no?), so its interesting to see that your findings actually point to them being linear.
Thanks again for all the research you have done and for sharing this valuable info!
|
Hi Jakeg, I've asked Racer20 to plug into this to help when he has some time, I'm far from a suspension engineer.
1/2: The M3/4 springs are close to the same rates , a bit less and linear front and rear. M2 rates are definitely higher up front. Not sure if spring rates would help in your situation, sounds like more of a byproduct of damper tuning / bump stops , tires...
3: Higher rear rates are a byproduct of wheel rates derived from the motion ratio, plus a small percentage to create "flat ride" and alleviate pitch front to rear.
4: I've seen linear springs look like progressive , barrel shaped etc. one other example of this might be Swift Spec R lowering springs.
Interesting about your track experience at COTA- first time out there about a few months ago attending the Carrera's of the America's and it was awesome. Quite a contrast to my home track (Sebring). I did run into a few individuals that were running DSC Sport in a few Porsche's. Ahhh the glazing over they're eyes when I told him about retrofitting the system into an M2. |
Awesome info, thanks!! Good point on the other factors that need to be played with. I might also go drive a m2 comp, reading that it's a bit more compliant on the roads. Your retrofit still seems like the best of all worlds; would just need to play with spring choices, tire sizes (18" wheels)..
looking forward to hearing Racer20 input as well!
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11 458 coupe, 91M3, 17RR SC
Previous-15 Audi S8, F430 SpiderGated, 10 GT3, 09 Carrera S, 06 ZCPM3 Sunroof delete 6MT 11k miles, 97e36M3, 02 M3GTS3trackrat
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