Quote:
Originally Posted by chris719
I don't know why you are laughing? The instrumented numbers tell this story. The car brakes better and accelerates faster, while it actually had a worse slalom result despite Cup 2 tires. I am sure it's just margin of error on that, though.
It is an M2C + tune + brake upgrade (optional) + M performance parts and M4 adaptive dampers. There is nothing wrong with that, but that's what it is. I'm not a naysayer, just calling it like it is.
It is an incremental increase in performance for a larger increase in price. You know, there is a reason I can get an M4 CS for a massive discount, right? That does NOT mean it isn't a good car. I just don't think it's priced very well compared to the competition. The cost difference between M2C and M2CS will probably be as much as the cost difference between M240i and M2C, except you are further on the diminishing returns part of the curve.
Again, there is no doubt this is the best M2 you can buy, but it's just another example of BMWs strategy to increase profit margin and reduce R&D costs with these "halo" models. I would be excited if they didn't spend their money on carbon fiber body panels that do almost nothing for performance over something like magnetorheological dampers or wider fenders to allow for more tire on a car that is desperately starved for traction even with an N55 engine.
I don't own M2 or M2C, so I'm not a salty owner, just trying to be objective about it.
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by chris719
Yes, in theory CCB is only better on repeated stops because of thermal resistance. Pretty much every single car on the road is traction limited on the first stop.
You are forgetting one important variable though. The brake pads. These cars are tested with stock pads from BMW. I can tell you from personal experience that the stock pads on CCB cars just hold up better than the pads that come on the blue brakes (not sure about 2NH - but there are lots of complaints about the stock pads on the street, even). So, if you don't replace your pads with track pads, the CCBs can actually perform better. This isn't a real world example, because we all know not to track a car with street pads, but it IS what the magazines do.
CCB calipers also have titanium pistons. It is entirely possible that they brake better over a lap given stock pads and the increased thermal resistance to the fluid.
Do not forget that the CCB rotors weigh a LOT less than the 2NH brakes. That is unsprung weight also, as I am sure you are aware.
|
I am laughing at the CCB comment.
First of, very little lap time can be gained from braking alone. Fast laps is about maximizing average speed throughout the entire course and proportionally, very little time/distance is spent braking.
It has been demonstrated in independent tests that there is very little to no braking distance improvement achieved with CCB relative to iron rotors with stock pads, even on repeated stops. The CCB will be able to take more abuse over the course of an entire session before showing signs of fade but this will not be apparent over one or two flying laps.
The reduced unsprung weight is probably the only meaningfull benefit of the CCB, but it's hard to tell how much it's worth in terms of lap times.
Regarding the performance of the stock pads, they perform impressively well on track. I had one incident where the pad material sheared off on one of my front track pads and I did not have a spare set with me. So I had to install back the stock pads to finish the day. Looking at my lap times, I was only a couple of tenths off my best lap. The caveat: I melted through a set of brand new stock pads in less than a track day. It is also crtical to be very diligent with proper brake management with the stock pads to avoid uneven pad deposit and ensuing brake shudder. This is why it is much preferable to switch to proper track pads.
Magnetorheological dampers also have their drawbacks and I wouldn't say they are necessarily better than the valved ones (our RS3 is equipped with magnetorheological dampers). Each have their pros and cons.
I agree that the CS in general are massively overpriced from an MSRP standpoint and this is particularly the case in the USA. Like I said many times, the CS are not intended for everyone, but with the big discounts offered, the "out the door" premium is more than worth for those that it appeals to.