[Dannydraws]

When taking my car in for it's first service under my name, I became aware of a pretty f***ed situation. I recently bought an M2 from a private bmw dealership in costa mesa - very reputable and respectable. The car had 5k miles on it, and it was mutually understood that the car's warranty was still in effect. In fact they even sold me an extended warranty. The car has been a dream and then around 10k miles a "diff lock limited error" light gets thrown up on my dash. The 10k service is up anyways so I figure I'll take it into my local bmw dealership to service and check it out, since the warranty is still in full effect. Long story short, my vin number comes up as "flagged" because apparently the car is tuned and boom, the entire warranty is voided. The differential error is possibly because of the tune, or they said I might need a new rear diff soon, which out of pocket would cost around 7k. F*** that.

So I see 2 scenarios here. Either the dealer who sold me the car lied to me (which im sure is very illegal), or they didn't do their job right and properly check the background of this car. I could and should have contacted bmw to run the vin myself before i bought the car, but that's honestly the dealer's job - I assumed it was just common practice, common sense, a clear given... guess not. Now I'm f***ed. What would you guys recommend I do?

My thinking is I'll talk to a lawyer, get all the contracts and paperwork in order to be presented to this dealer, lay it all on the table and ask them how they are going to fix this situation for me. I feel like this all clearly falls on them, even if it does say "sold as is" in the paperwork. Ah honorable business would buy the car back from me, buy me an external warranty that would work, or at the very least refund me for the extended warranty I paid for as well as some kind of settlement for future repairs and services.

This sucks, any tips?

[AndrewC1989]

How exactly can/will you prove that the car was tuned before you bought it?

Can't they just say the car wasn't tuned when they sold it to you and that you were the one who tuned it?

[Rick4345]

I'm guessing this "private" dealership doesn't have a service department.

Sounds like they should honor the extended warranty you bought from them.

Talk to the dealership and explain your problem. If they don't give you any satisfaction talk to your attorney.

BMW isn't going to fix it under warranty. That's already been established.

Good luck.

[Dannydraws]

Apparently those diagnostics are logged and dated. If not... f***. :/

And no this private dealer does not have a service dept... yet! When I was buying the car there in January, the place was under construction because they were expanding and adding a service dept. So if they offered to honor the warranty there.. when it's ready... that would be nice. Very nice.

[Nine Lives]

I can't imagine that a tuned M2 would trash the diff unless it was severely abused.
There was a recall on earlier models with the diff and is well known.How old is the car ?
Is it possible the previous owner might not have bothered to get it updated and you've taken the hit because of that ?

https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1310964

[Dannydraws]

Yeah its way too soon for a new diff on a 2017 M2. A late 2017 at that. I'm hoping flashing the ecu back to stock will fix that code, I read about similar issues on another M2 as well as other cars.

[M2C_PLUS]

Originally Posted by Dannydraws

Yeah its way too soon for a new diff on a 2017 M2. A late 2017 at that. I'm hoping flashing the ecu back to stock will fix that code, I read about similar issues on another M2 as well as other cars.

If the BMW dealer says its "tuned" ask for the data showing so. They can easily tell by the log of the fuel pressure rail "pressure" if I remember rightly. However, I think after so many "engine start cycles" it clears a certain amount of historical data, this means you may never know the point at which the tune/boost was increased.

Im not 100% sure on the above but its not far off.

First thing first though, do you have an invoice/receipt stating the car was sold with a manufactures warranty in place? If not, you are going to have one hell of a hard time proving it was sold to you with one, sorry to say.

I hope it all goes your way.

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by Dannydraws

Apparently those diagnostics are logged and dated. If not... f***. :/

And no this private dealer does not have a service dept... yet! When I was buying the car there in January, the place was under construction because they were expanding and adding a service dept. So if they offered to honor the warranty there.. when it's ready... that would be nice. Very nice.

please define " private dealer"

This dealer

1- has BMW in it's name
2- does NOT have BMW in it's name

The extended warranty is sold and serviced by whom?

[ried]

Sorry dude, but there is no BMW dealership in Costa Mesa. If you bought an used M2 from "California Beemers," they aren't an official BMW dealership (hence the kind-of-but-not-really-BMW name). They probably got the M2 at auction because an actual BMW dealer couldn't sell it.

The nearest official dealership is Sterling BMW of Newport Beach.

I agree with the previous commenters, they have to honor the extended warranty they sold you. Let them try to subrogate their claim with BMW North America. Not your problem.

[Dannydraws]

Yeah I didn't get this from an official bmw dealer. It was in fact "California Beemers". They seem to have such a good track record and reputation, so this situation is surprising. I imagine it's a pretty rare case, and I'll have to triple check all the paperwork but having a warranty on this car was one of the biggest selling points for me and was talked about extensively when buying the car. As far as proving it was tuned before in my hands, I guess all I can do is get copies of the bmw vin history and all other reports that i can.

[Mosely]

Originally Posted by ried

Sorry dude, but there is no BMW dealership in Costa Mesa. If you bought an used M2 from "California Beemers," they aren't an official BMW dealership (hence the kind-of-but-not-really-BMW name). They probably got the M2 at auction because an actual BMW dealer couldn't sell it.

The nearest official dealership is Sterling BMW of Newport Beach.

I agree with the previous commenters, they have to honor the extended warranty they sold you. Let them try to subrogate their claim with BMW North America. Not your problem.

I feel like there's always more to the story...

Also, OP said they told him its a flagged VIN when he brought it in for his first service. Did they flag it right there or was it flagged previously? If its the latter then they should be able to tell you when it was flagged and you'll have more to go against the dealership that sold you the car. If it's the former, then you're probably screwed because the original dealer can just say you tuned it after they sold it to you.

It's the risk you take when buying a second hand car. Proper due diligence would have been to have it checked out by a real BMW dealership prior to buying, but obviously it's easy to say in retrospect. The "dealer" you bought from may have had no idea it was flagged by BMW and I don't think I've heard of a used car dealer ever calling the manufacturer to ask that. They might have known and "lied" to you but unless you asked them if it was tuned AND have documentation from them showing that it wasn't, then from a legal standpoint you're probably not going to have much.

Hopefully they honor your extended warranty deal...I think BMW could easily make a case that the tune = increased power = increased risk of diff damage.

[Dannydraws]

It was flagged previously, he showed me the logs with dates and everything. And yeah, these private dealers don't have access to BMW's vin records so chances are they weren't aware of the tune. Sounding like this might be a bit of a battle...

[shemeld_135]

Originally Posted by andrewc89

How exactly can/will you prove that the car was tuned before you bought it?

Can't they just say the car wasn't tuned when they sold it to you and that you were the one who tuned it?

Can you get the dates when it was flagged and the dates when you purchased it.. that should show it was flagged b4 purchase right?

[Dannydraws]

I can and I will. In theory that should work...
plus proof from BMW NA that it was indeed flagged for the tune. Hopefully I can get all that on paper...

[ried]

It was probably flagged a long time ago, which is why it was auctioned off to this unofficial dealer, rather than the car being offered by an official BMW dealership. Sucks.

[Tag]

Originally Posted by Dannydraws

It was flagged previously, he showed me the logs with dates and everything. And yeah, these private dealers don't have access to BMW's vin records so chances are they weren't aware of the tune. Sounding like this might be a bit of a battle...

That goes in your favor as you can prove it was sold to you that way. I'd try to work with them before getting any lawyers involved. If they are reputable and are willing then great. If not you have a solid case that you were sold a car and extended warranty that will not be honored without full disclosure the car was flagged.

P.S. First clue these guys are a bit dodgy is there name. In BMW nomenclature cars are bimmers, motorcycles are beemers/beamers. After all, this is bimmerpost.

[AndrewC1989]

Originally Posted by Tag

In BMW nomenclature cars are bimmers, motorcycles are beemers/beamers. After all, this is bimmerpost.

Glad I wasn't the only one who noticed this

[M3 Adjuster]

it sounds as if the OEM warranty is not being honored by the BMW dealer..

the private party extended warranty likely is still in effect and still valid... and of course the typical extended warranty picks up after the original OEM warranty period has expired. So.. the extended warranty really isn't in play if the original warranty would still apply.

Speaking of the original OEM warranty..

NO automobile dealer or manufacturer can void an ENTIRE vehicle warranty due to aftermarket parts being installed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnus...s_Warranty_Act

also https://www.ftc.gov/enforcement/stat...provements-act

now then.... Certain PARTS of the OEM warranty can be revoked.. if damage is caused by an aftermarket part......

So... the first thing to determine is... WHAT has caused the failure?

an OEM part? or.. aftermarket work done to the vehicle... once you know the answer there.. you know how to approach the dealer..

Actually... I would approach the dealer service manager IMMEDIATELY , refer to the Magnusson Moss Warrranty act (bring a printed original copy of the document and hand it to the manager) and ask any person that works in the dealership that has advised you the " Entire vehicle warranty is voided" to be FIRED summarily, and then begin a discussion of how they feel that an aftermarket tune has caused your differential to fail.

The dealer would need to be able to prove that the failure was caused by an aftermarket part for the OEM warranty for that item to apply. In other words.. if you put an aftermarket exhaust on your car... and the engine blows up... the dealer would need to prove that the exhaust caused the motor to fail in order to not honor any warranty on the motor. All of the rest of the vehicle would STILL have coverage ... so if say.. your stereo fails... that would be still covered.


OF course... the tune IS the only mod to your vehicle right? you aren't holding back any other details on mods are you?

[pz619]

I agree with a lot of what was posted above. Here is my take/suggestions:

1. Even if buying from a dealership (different than the car's brand), it's not a bad idea to spend money on a PPI, especially if spending a pretty good amount of money. In this case, it's likely a true BMW dealership would have seen the flag.

2. Your third party warranty should still apply in this case. Most are worded that you need to try the manufacturers warranty first. Since you've already done this the 3rd party should be picking up the bill. Also as M3 Adjuster noted above, it's not that the entire warranty is voided. It's probably just the power train.

3. If you really want, consider a lawyer, but I don't think it'll help. I'm not even close to a legal expert, but listening to Steve Lehto's podcast over the years has given me some baseline information to go off of. If there is no expressed warranty stating that this sale includes manufacturer's warranty, there isn't much you can do here. It's pretty much defined as the standard "as is" sale. The typical statement is "as is, with all faults". Also verbal doesn't really count here. Needs to be in writing. If you feel strongly enough, consider an actual lawyer to consult with.

In the end, this really sucks for all parties involved excluding the guy that got the car flagged in the first place. I don't think there is much you can do outside of the selling dealership might be willing to work with you on a goodwill basis. I doubt there is any legal obligation, especially if it isn't in writing.

Consider watching this if you get a moment. It gives you an idea of what passes and what doesn't. Title is a bit strong but the content is applicable I believe. It basically boils down to it doesn't really matter what the salesman says, it's all about what written down in the purchase agreement.

[Dannydraws]

Thanks for that link to the Magnusson Moss Warranty act. I'll be seeing them tomorrow so I will definitely print that out and show them.

I highly doubt the diff is actually failing and the tune is the cause of that error popping up. As far as other mods, the car came with the MPE as well. Nothing else from what I've been told or seen myself at this point.

Thanks for the video pz! I will watch that right now.

Thanks for all the input guys. I truly appreciate it. This definitely sucks for all parties involved, lessons learned all around. I'm really really really hoping CA Beemers cooperates and moves forward with fair intentions.

[akkando]

Originally Posted by Dannydraws

It was flagged previously, he showed me the logs with dates and everything. And yeah, these private dealers don't have access to BMW's vin records so chances are they weren't aware of the tune. Sounding like this might be a bit of a battle...

I would contact my local papers and television networks and see if they want to run a story about this dealership selling "warrantied" cars and extended warranties for cars that can't be warrantied if the dealer you bought it from won't make this right.

[HTTP 410]

This probably isn't much help, but if you're going to have to come out-of-pocket some cash, what about a warranty through a credit union? Not sure about them where you are, but the ones in my area over varying coverage and deductibles. This may be your best option in the long run...

Sorry for your issues. People, generally speaking, suck...