BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
BMW M2 Forum > M2 vs... > It's official: (Lap times) TT RS faster than M2, M4 and M6.

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      03-15-2017, 07:45 AM   #67
dmboone25
Lieutenant General
dmboone25's Avatar
4971
Rep
10,200
Posts

Drives: 2024 Golf R / 2022 718 Spyder
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Dallas, TX

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2007 E92 328i  [10.00]
2007 328i  [10.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by krizze View Post
Actually i do see where this guy is coming from, the TTRS is a marvellous piece of engineering the interior is out of this world with the tech being next level, with all this however, its still and always will be regarded as a Hairdressers car or be it a flight attendants dream
You know, I have gotten this same sort of jab for my 981, but it's just part of the deal I think - when you have a small, good looking car, people will say things of this nature.

It doesn't bother me, although I will say that some cars certainly appear to be more effeminate than others - the TT-RS would certainly appear more so compared to the bulldogishness of the M2.
__________________
Past rides: 2016 981 BGTS, 2020 MINI JCW, 2017 F80, 2015 981 CS, 2014 F22 235, 2011 E82 135, 2008 E82 135, 2007 E92 328, 2007 E92 328 (My lady drives an OG M2. So does my dad)
Appreciate 0
      03-15-2017, 10:00 AM   #68
BruceM
Major
983
Rep
1,153
Posts

Drives: '17 6MT MG M2,930,Jag XKR 5.0
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Seattle

iTrader: (0)

If a TTRS with or without carbon fiber gets out the door for "70k" in American dollars anywhere, I would be very, very surprised. I suppose we'll see.

I think the interior is definitely pretty. The M2 interior is understated, utilitarian, functional. I prefer the latter in a car like this, but certainly others can differ.

I want a stick. The TTRS doesn't have one.

I want RWD. The TTRS is front-biased AWD.

I think the rear of the TTRS looks tacked on. I much prefer the integrated haunches of the M2.

Although I haven't heard a TTRS in the wild, the sound of an M2 with a stock exhaust and a catted DP, and ASD coded out, is just fine with me.

I'd also like to be able to put my wife and grown kids in the car from time to time.

These factors, taken together, are far more important to me than pure "speed," no matter how that is defined. Besides, with the Dinan kit, or a Stage 1 Pure set-up, which can be installed and still keep you under what a TTRS is likely to cost, the delta will be minimal at a track, and it will be a whole lot more fun.

The OP simply does not value any of these things. This is why, in his more frenzied moments, he accuses others who criticize his favorite of being "illogical," and says things like "have fun when you can't catch up to the TTRS on a highway," and similar such nonsense.

Instead, it is that accusation that is illogical. Never was "different strokes for different folks" more applicable than here.
Appreciate 1
Robin_NL8679.50
      03-15-2017, 01:38 PM   #69
M2GranCoupeOLEDlights
Second Lieutenant
45
Rep
243
Posts

Drives: Bmw M2
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Puerto Rico

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by BruceM View Post
If a TTRS with or without carbon fiber gets out the door for "70k" in American dollars anywhere, I would be very, very surprised. I suppose we'll see.

I think the interior is definitely pretty. The M2 interior is understated, utilitarian, functional. I prefer the latter in a car like this, but certainly others can differ.

I want a stick. The TTRS doesn't have one.

I want RWD. The TTRS is front-biased AWD.

I think the rear of the TTRS looks tacked on. I much prefer the integrated haunches of the M2.

Although I haven't heard a TTRS in the wild, the sound of an M2 with a stock exhaust and a catted DP, and ASD coded out, is just fine with me.

I'd also like to be able to put my wife and grown kids in the car from time to time.

These factors, taken together, are far more important to me than pure "speed," no matter how that is defined. Besides, with the Dinan kit, or a Stage 1 Pure set-up, which can be installed and still keep you under what a TTRS is likely to cost, the delta will be minimal at a track, and it will be a whole lot more fun.

The OP simply does not value any of these things. This is why, in his more frenzied moments, he accuses others who criticize his favorite of being "illogical," and says things like "have fun when you can't catch up to the TTRS on a highway," and similar such nonsense.

Instead, it is that accusation that is illogical. Never was "different strokes for different folks" more applicable than here.
Let me set you straight on some things.

First, I add an image with the prices IN CANADIAN. Carbon fiber is just 950. Retail price is 55-62k in USD.

So, be surprised I guess! Just check the prices.

M2 interior, sure, if it floats your boat, let's leave it at that!

I don't want a stick, but I can shift with Gear Lever whenever I do. Traffic/more concentrated on cornering and all that, faster shifts, you name it.

I can appreciate those who want to be classical though, just not for me.

It being AWD/FW bias is not much of an issue for me, it can still drift/oversteer and it's much safer. As for the fun factor, I need to drive it first.

I prefer the TT RS rear a lot more to the M2. The OLED lights are awesome and M2's taillights just don't do it for me...I just don't like the shape. I prefer the quad exhausts though but the Front diffuser of the TT RS, in black, is just awesome.

It sounds better, it's supposed to. Unmodded. Sounds louder, has more horsepower and can have a performance exhaust like MPE but only for 900 (CAD!) -MPE is what 3k and you can't even order it?- subjective I guess, but many BMW owners agree with me. I posted in the M4 forums and I'll share some of the reactions later.

I don't have kids, and if I do, they will fit comfortably for a decade or so?

It's a better daily driver.

Don't know why you say I don't value these things, I do I simply apply them to my personal situation.

As for fun on the track, you talk about modding the M2...imagine modding a TT RS with an ECU + sway bars to let it oversteer more if you want?

It will always come out winning and I'm sure it will be fun...how could it not?

Btw, it's much lighter so each extra horsepower is means more than in the M2.

They're both good cars, just depends on what you're gonna need it for.
Attached Images
 
Appreciate 0
      03-15-2017, 03:09 PM   #70
AndyinHou
Lieutenant
478
Rep
527
Posts

Drives: 2017 LBB M2, 2023 M2 BG O.T.W.
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Houston

iTrader: (0)

Can we give this the 'thread of the year' award please? The only rival is 'should I wait for the LCI...'
Appreciate 0
      03-15-2017, 09:23 PM   #71
M2GranCoupeOLEDlights
Second Lieutenant
45
Rep
243
Posts

Drives: Bmw M2
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Puerto Rico

iTrader: (0)

So I went ahead and asked M3/M4 owners what they thought, since people here called me blind.

Enjoy.


Cheers,
Carrot Eater
Attached Images
       
Appreciate 0
      03-15-2017, 09:26 PM   #72
thereisnoSub
Banned
14
Rep
27
Posts

Drives: 2011 911TurboS
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Always ahead of a BMW

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rapture1 View Post
Interesting article, I have a deposit down on both the TT RS and an M2 CS. I'm hoping to get the Audi later this year and see how the M2 CS story unfolds. I've always been fond of AWD. I agree with what they say about the Audi's engine and it's sound, that's something that's very important to me and I think it would keep me from purchasing the Porsche with the Turbo 4, and I'm not a "track" person. I sold a 991 C4S a few months ago with the sport exhaust, now that car sounded fantastic but from what I hear online the Audi may have it beat. I also agree though that Audi should have given the car some body flares like many of their other RS' cars, it would have certainly made it more unique and one big reason the M2 is so cool. Also to their point, I'm going to order mine with the rear wing delete, I think it looks better without it.

They are all nice cars though and fit slightly different needs. No losers amongst them.


DO NOT DELETE the wing. It is VERY crucial to high speed stability.
This is a huge safety feature. Trust me.
Appreciate 0
      03-15-2017, 10:28 PM   #73
Rapture1
Private First Class
Rapture1's Avatar
69
Rep
125
Posts

Drives: 2021 BMW M2C
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Milwaukee, WI, USA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2018 Audi TTRS  [8.00]
2017 Porsche C4S  [9.50]
2011 BMW 1M Coupe  [10.00]
2007 Audi RS4  [5.50]
2004 VW R32  [6.50]
2021 M2 Competition  [9.50]
Quote:
Originally Posted by thereisnoSub View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rapture1 View Post
Interesting article, I have a deposit down on both the TT RS and an M2 CS. I'm hoping to get the Audi later this year and see how the M2 CS story unfolds. I've always been fond of AWD. I agree with what they say about the Audi's engine and it's sound, that's something that's very important to me and I think it would keep me from purchasing the Porsche with the Turbo 4, and I'm not a "track" person. I sold a 991 C4S a few months ago with the sport exhaust, now that car sounded fantastic but from what I hear online the Audi may have it beat. I also agree though that Audi should have given the car some body flares like many of their other RS' cars, it would have certainly made it more unique and one big reason the M2 is so cool. Also to their point, I'm going to order mine with the rear wing delete, I think it looks better without it.

They are all nice cars though and fit slightly different needs. No losers amongst them.


DO NOT DELETE the wing. It is VERY crucial to high speed stability.
This is a huge safety feature. Trust me.
If you delete the wing you still get the standard automatically extending version.
__________________
Rapture
Appreciate 0
      03-16-2017, 02:09 AM   #74
Robin_NL
S0THPAW
Robin_NL's Avatar
8680
Rep
7,846
Posts

Drives: HS M2 Competition
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: The Netherlands

iTrader: (0)

As already stated by others TT RS basis/chassis is a VAG/Volkswagen 'Golf' FWD layout with Haldex support for the rear wheels.
It's not 'Quattro' like it was invented at the end of the 70s, with the Urquattro and derived Gr B monsters (and the current lineup) with longitudinal engines driving 4 wheels.
But it works in slippery conditions(doh)
Irl the layout with the 2.5 5 pot almost hanging over the frontbumper make it more noseheavy than wished for.
Being 95 kgs lighter than M2 (which is a fourseater) is godsent and a nice achievement, nontheless it still has a weight distribution of 61% front and 39% rear....(M2 52/48)

Also having 'Quattro' AND 30-40HP more it's logical it's faster from a standstill. Not so much through (in) gear irl where the M2 is faster fwiw as 'Autobild M2 wins vs TT RS' shows us, plus the ceramic brakes on the Audi were malfunctioning.

Having said that I think the TT RS is a nice very fast not so good looking car(I'm not going to use the hairdressers jokes anymore) with a nice engine. It looks like a flat beetle and without the rearspoiler, what is the front and what is the backend. But hey subjective....
Though a V10 sounds marvellous, it's not a V12. Same goes for 5 inline vs inline 6 imho. But whe found out that's very subjective too

Also, the fwd based Haldex Quattro system is understeer biased with some electronic trickery to 'slide' the tail out for the sake of it. It does it best in winter/snow circumstances. Does it matter? No.
The whole TTRS setup to start from , from a (race/sport) engineering standpoint has flaws. From weight distribution to the used Haldex. The car makes up for it by being lighter and having more hp than M2.

The fatty M2 has this as a basic chassis setup with a ver high tech M diff which makes the car point in better than any M car before on track in moist 2nd gear corners. Unreal. I bet it points in better than a lot of Caymans due to that diff....and even if you never attend trackdays you can feel it in real life B road spirited driving....
Quote:
For example, just the control arms, wheel carriers, axle subframes and stiffening plate of the double-joint spring-strut front axle weigh five kilograms less than would be the case with a conventional steel construction. Further stiffening measures optimise rigidity throughout the car.



All the control arms and wheel carriers of the new BMW M2’s five-link rear axle are made from forged aluminium, which reduces the unsprung masses of the wheel-locating components by around three kilograms compared to a steel construction. In addition, a racing-derived rigid connection, dispensing with rubber bushings, is used to fix the lightweight steel grid-type rear axle subframe to the body.
Enough of the technical stuff. M2 isn't miles ahead in the interior department. Aun contraire: It almost looks outdated vs TT RS.....
But it is lightyears ahead in race engineering/balance/chassis/steering and braking....and driving fun. 100% That's why it wins at Top Gear and Autobild and the rest.
(and it loses@ EVO because it has adjustable dampers....)

So take your pick.

Edit, Lightweight/Laptime Perf/Schnitzer and other tuners show us with tuning adjustments and engineering M2 can drive in GT3 991 laptime territory. With only about 50hp more.

A TTRS can be given 500-600-700hp it still stays a fwd platform with Haldex supporting the rear wheels and the engine hanging over the frontaxle. You can't change that....

Cheers
Robin

Last edited by Robin_NL; 03-16-2017 at 02:18 AM..
Appreciate 2
BruceM983.00
M2Dynamic183.50
      03-16-2017, 04:46 AM   #75
Q8
Enlisted Member
34
Rep
33
Posts

Drives: MG M2
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Kuwait

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M2GranCoupeOLEDlights View Post
So I went ahead and asked M3/M4 owners what they thought, since people here called me blind.

Enjoy.


Cheers,
Carrot Eater
I won't argue and go back and forth with numbers, papers, reviews. And now you screen shot M4 owners opinion that most don't care about seriously! If i went to Laferrari owners and they loved the M2 looks and sound does it matter for me ? Absolutely NOT.

Me and You share the point​ that TTRS is faster better engine better interior. But it ends up there due to personal preference! I prefer M2 exterior and practical space and the enough power and fun it provides. Maybe if i was 22 with no family and live near a beautiful twisty roads and sites i would consider the rs roadster ! Get my point? It's all about what best for you.

Just a piece of advice, there is nothing wrong posting about faster more powerful cars than the M2. But your way of promoting it is kinda of " LOOK AT THISSSS, IT'S WAYYY BETTER ON EVERY THING THAN THE ONE YOU DRIVE AND LOVE".

You're praising the TTRS way too much, and it's a better choice for you. Not for me not to many others.
Appreciate 3
Dav3946.50
Robin_NL8679.50
atxsk8r1568.50
      03-16-2017, 12:27 PM   #76
gtr
Lieutenant
gtr's Avatar
United_States
235
Rep
576
Posts

Drives: 2020 CTR
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Michigan

iTrader: (0)

I'm thinking about trading my M2 for the ttrs to hold me over until the M2 cs. The problem is if I can't get the cs. I'm curious which car is better drive as a secondary work commuter.

Ttrs quarter miles time is tempting.
Appreciate 0
      03-16-2017, 04:48 PM   #77
csbear
Major
csbear's Avatar
1118
Rep
1,054
Posts

Drives: SO M2C
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Las Vegas, NV

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by gtr View Post
I'm thinking about trading my M2 for the ttrs to hold me over until the M2 cs. The problem is if I can't get the cs. I'm curious which car is better drive as a secondary work commuter.

Ttrs quarter miles time is tempting.
Do you still have the GT4?

We have similar tastes in cars, although I'm sure many here think along the same lines.

I had the GT4... Now on the list for the M2CS, but still interested in the TTRS as well.
Appreciate 0
      03-16-2017, 08:20 PM   #78
gtr
Lieutenant
gtr's Avatar
United_States
235
Rep
576
Posts

Drives: 2020 CTR
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Michigan

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by csbear View Post
Do you still have the GT4?

We have similar tastes in cars, although I'm sure many here think along the same lines.

I had the GT4... Now on the list for the M2CS, but still interested in the TTRS as well.
Yes, and that car will be replaced by the next gt4/rs or the current just released gt3 if I can get an allocation. I'd get rid of the gt4 & M2 in a heart beat for the latest GT p-car.

Plan was to sell the M2 with the e46M3 and ttrs holding me over till the 2018/19 m2cs. But I may like the M2 too much?
Appreciate 1
csbear1118.00
      03-17-2017, 12:55 PM   #79
IS3andME
Major
482
Rep
1,189
Posts

Drives: Lexus IS300
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Maryland

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M2GranCoupeOLEDlights View Post
Wanted something that incites economic activity with enfasis on local businesses in order to make couples get out of the house and take on new adventures to create unforgettable moments, rather than spending all of the free time on Netflix/movie theater.

Help relationships keep the spark alive?

Help the economy?

Making a living out of this?

Yes please!
"Netflix and Chill" keeps the spark alive...
Appreciate 0
      03-17-2017, 07:26 PM   #80
No Boost
enthusiasm > practicality
No Boost's Avatar
United_States
4019
Rep
2,247
Posts

Drives: 987 CS | G35x
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Chester County, PA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
C&D, in today's first drive of the RS3, has an estimated base price of $60,000 USD. By comparison, the TTRS will be several thousands more, putting it on par with the M4.

Yes, it's only estimated but these US journalists have the inside scoop of manufacturers doings.
__________________
FSI 3.8L Stg II|6MT|SOUL|IPD+GT3 TB|Numeric Racing|KW|Tarett|Rennline|Raceseng|APEX|Recaro|7.3 lb/hp
VQ35HR|5AT|Stillen|FI|UpRev tune 8k rpm|TransGo|Hotchkis|Whiteline|H&R|Z1|Corbeau|R1 Concepts|10 lb/hp
Left lane campers, GTFO!
Appreciate 0
      03-21-2017, 07:33 AM   #81
wigit
New Member
9
Rep
27
Posts

Drives: M2 on order
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: England

iTrader: (0)

So in the M2 you are having more fun and get to enjoy it marginally longer, win win

You actually have to drive the M2, mqb haldex cars are just point and squirt (I know I still have two)
Appreciate 0
      03-21-2017, 06:06 PM   #82
M2GranCoupeOLEDlights
Second Lieutenant
45
Rep
243
Posts

Drives: Bmw M2
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Puerto Rico

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by gtr View Post
Yes, and that car will be replaced by the next gt4/rs or the current just released gt3 if I can get an allocation. I'd get rid of the gt4 & M2 in a heart beat for the latest GT p-car.

Plan was to sell the M2 with the e46M3 and ttrs holding me over till the 2018/19 m2cs. But I may like the M2 too much?
Enjoy that new TT RS!
Appreciate 0
      03-21-2017, 07:24 PM   #83
M2GranCoupeOLEDlights
Second Lieutenant
45
Rep
243
Posts

Drives: Bmw M2
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Puerto Rico

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by IS3andME View Post
"Netflix and Chill" keeps the spark alive...
I don't understand your comment?
Appreciate 0
      03-21-2017, 10:36 PM   #84
nd2002
First Lieutenant
nd2002's Avatar
179
Rep
295
Posts

Drives: 2017 M2
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Seattle, WA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M2GranCoupeOLEDlights View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by IS3andME View Post
"Netflix and Chill" keeps the spark alive...
I don't understand your comment?
Look up "Netflix and chill" on Google.
Appreciate 0
      03-22-2017, 10:22 AM   #85
M2GranCoupeOLEDlights
Second Lieutenant
45
Rep
243
Posts

Drives: Bmw M2
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Puerto Rico

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by nd2002 View Post
Look up "Netflix and chill" on Google.
I know what it is, but why does it keep the spark alive and why that emote?
Appreciate 0
      03-22-2017, 01:40 PM   #86
nd2002
First Lieutenant
nd2002's Avatar
179
Rep
295
Posts

Drives: 2017 M2
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: Seattle, WA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by M2GranCoupeOLEDlights View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by nd2002 View Post
Look up "Netflix and chill" on Google.
I know what it is, but why does it keep the spark alive and why that emote?
IS3andMe is trying to say that sex keeps the spark in relationships alive.
Appreciate 0
      03-23-2017, 01:32 AM   #87
M2GranCoupeOLEDlights
Second Lieutenant
45
Rep
243
Posts

Drives: Bmw M2
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Puerto Rico

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by nd2002 View Post
IS3andMe is trying to say that sex keeps the spark in relationships alive.
Lol. Ok then. Useful stuff.
Appreciate 0
      04-02-2017, 11:47 AM   #88
M2GranCoupeOLEDlights
Second Lieutenant
45
Rep
243
Posts

Drives: Bmw M2
Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Puerto Rico

iTrader: (0)

So apparently Audi has tweaked Haldex and made it possible to send 100% to the rear if slippage is detected, which makes sense when they said it wasn't hard to drift...

If it this turns out to be not true, you can achieve it with a haldex chip that modifies it.
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:44 AM.




m2
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST