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      08-24-2016, 08:22 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eimsteim View Post
As for pulling the alignment pins on the strut tower to give yourself more front camber that is allowed. Falls under Section 13.8 Part E of the SCCA Rule book.
The M2 has no front alignment pins to pull though, correct?
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      08-24-2016, 11:25 AM   #24
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I'm not 100% because I have not pulled what i believe are the alignment pins but according to this picture that I found on the internet, that corresponds to what mine looks like under the hood, it does appear that they do.
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      08-24-2016, 11:40 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eimsteim View Post
I'm not 100% because I have not pulled what i believe are the alignment pins but according to this picture that I found on the internet, that corresponds to what mine looks like under the hood, it does appear that they do
My understanding is that the 2-series (and F3x/F8x) do not have alignment pins hence no adjustment possible. The nubs that you're likely seeing in that picture are centering pins, unlike traditional BMW strut mounts of the past -- there are two of them on the strut mount top; see pic here.
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      08-24-2016, 12:14 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSBM5 View Post
My understanding is that the 2-series (and F3x/F8x) do not have alignment pins hence no adjustment possible. The nubs that you're likely seeing in that picture are centering pins, unlike traditional BMW strut mounts of the past -- there are two of them on the strut mount top; see pic here.
Your picture definitely trumps mine. I would say it looks like you're right here and I was misinformed. Note: I have been watching tire wear and rollover closely on the car during autox and it appears that the camber is close to perfect at the stock ride height currently and I have not felt the need to change the stock camber settings yet. This may be a symptom of my driving style and not a one size fits all alignment but I'm still happy with it and I'm not sad knowing that I can't change the front camber as I initially thought.
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      09-09-2016, 11:38 AM   #27
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If you don't have it, check out harry's lap timer app.. I use it road racing and its got a zillion features....
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      09-11-2016, 08:34 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eimsteim
Quote:
Originally Posted by hocm View Post
From the August fastrack:

http://cdn.growassets.net/user_files...pdf?1469031412

Looks like both the M2 and Focus RS will likely be in BS with the C5 FRC for 2017.

Anyone think the port installed m performance coilovers are b street legal?

Is there any provision for camber adjustment on the front of the car (like pulling the alignment pins on the front of the E92)?
I can speak to all of this since my wife and I are working closely with the Solo Advisory Board in an attempt to get the M2 officially classed for 2017; we have a vested interest in the outcome and want to make sure the car is classed fairly and competitively. As of right now any port installed option that alters the performance characteristics of the car (including lip spoilers and diffusers) are not allowed in the Street Rules. There was some discussion of this as they can be ordered from the factory with those options but because they do not roll of the assembly line with the parts installed they are not legal in Street. If you opt to have the suspension changes they would most likely put you in STU. Motion Control offers a strut replacement for the F87 currently that would be a great option if you were looking at staying in street.

As for pulling the alignment pins on the strut tower to give yourself more front camber that is allowed. Falls under Section 13.8 Part E of the SCCA Rule book.
Quote:
If offered by the manufacturer for a particular model and year, the use of shims, special bolts, removal of material to enlarge mounting holes, and similar methods are allowed and the resulting alignment settings are permitted even if outside the normal specification or range of specifications recommended by the manufacturer. If enlarging mounting holes is specifically authorized but no material removal limits are specified, material removal is restricted to the amount.

Scca Solo and "classed correctly " .. Isn't that an oxymoron .. ...

Seriously .. Good luck though. Most BMWs don't fare well in BMW classing.

With that info added by CSBM5 about the lack of * any * adjustability for the stock alignment, wow... There's no way this car won't be killed in classing for SCCA.

They simply don't have a good workaround for placing cars that have a significant design advantage/disadvantage.
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      09-14-2016, 02:53 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSBM5 View Post
My understanding is that the 2-series (and F3x/F8x) do not have alignment pins hence no adjustment possible. The nubs that you're likely seeing in that picture are centering pins, unlike traditional BMW strut mounts of the past -- there are two of them on the strut mount top; see pic here.
What about these crash knuckles on realoem... BS legal? http://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/part...&q=31217853639

Sound like crash bolts to me just ten times as expensive ~$500 per side. 30 minutes is half a degree of camber, right?

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/show...diagId=31_1121

Also, I'm not sure that your interpretation of whether port installed items like the m performance coilovers are legal is correct. Can't the frs in c street and the ds/hs jcw minis all take advantage of port installed sway bars and springs and stay in street class?

Last edited by hocm; 09-14-2016 at 03:04 PM..
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      09-14-2016, 10:05 PM   #30
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I sent out a couple emails and messages trying to figure out where a bone stock M2 would run but had no luck with some of the local SCCA chapters..

I used to run in SMF but no idea where the M2 would run..
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      09-15-2016, 06:51 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EL BAN View Post
I sent out a couple emails and messages trying to figure out where a bone stock M2 would run but had no luck with some of the local SCCA chapters..

I used to run in SMF but no idea where the M2 would run..
This info was published by the SCCA in the Fastrack bulletins where earlier this year they stated that the M2 was released too late to qualify for 2016 Nationals, so it would be formally classed afterward (before 2017 official rulebook is released). However, "For regional competition,
the SAC recommends running this car in BS (B-street)."
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      09-15-2016, 12:49 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSBM5 View Post
This info was published by the SCCA in the Fastrack bulletins where earlier this year they stated that the M2 was released too late to qualify for 2016 Nationals, so it would be formally classed afterward (before 2017 official rulebook is released). However, "For regional competition,
the SAC recommends running this car in BS (B-street)."
Thanks for the info!
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      09-22-2016, 07:53 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSBM5
Quote:
Originally Posted by EL BAN View Post
I sent out a couple emails and messages trying to figure out where a bone stock M2 would run but had no luck with some of the local SCCA chapters..

I used to run in SMF but no idea where the M2 would run..
This info was published by the SCCA in the Fastrack bulletins where earlier this year they stated that the M2 was released too late to qualify for 2016 Nationals, so it would be formally classed afterward (before 2017 official rulebook is released). However, "For regional competition,
the SAC recommends running this car in BS (B-street)."
:bs:
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      09-23-2016, 12:06 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hocm View Post
What about these crash knuckles on realoem... BS legal? http://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/part...&q=31217853639

Sound like crash bolts to me just ten times as expensive ~$500 per side. 30 minutes is half a degree of camber, right?

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/show...diagId=31_1121

Also, I'm not sure that your interpretation of whether port installed items like the m performance coilovers are legal is correct. Can't the frs in c street and the ds/hs jcw minis all take advantage of port installed sway bars and springs and stay in street class?
FRS TRD Limited edition came out which allowed all FRS cars to update/backdate to the suspension that was offered on the limited edition car. Not because it was a port installed options.

Mini coopers have the option of a JCW package from the factory allowing cars to update/backdate their suspensions to use those components.

If BMW releases a M2 Trim level or Package (Not CS) that includes the M adjustable suspension then they will be allowed. If you have to customize your order from a dealer with those pieces installed either at port or at the dealership then they are not allowed in Street classes. Quick way to get your answer on newer cars, if you can go to the webpage and spec out the car before you get to "accessories" then it's legal in street. If you click on it as an accessory or a write in when you go to the dealership and order the car then it is not allowed.
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      10-21-2016, 01:44 PM   #35
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Updating earlier guidance from the SCCA. In the November Fastrack, SCCA released the official stock class for 2017 for the M2: B-street.
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      11-02-2016, 09:18 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eimsteim View Post
As of right now any port installed option that alters the performance characteristics of the car (including lip spoilers and diffusers) are not allowed in the Street Rules. There was some discussion of this as they can be ordered from the factory with those options but because they do not roll of the assembly line with the parts installed they are not legal in Street. If you opt to have the suspension changes they would most likely put you in STU. Motion Control offers a strut replacement for the F87 currently that would be a great option if you were looking at staying in street.
First post, long time lurker.

Are you talking about a new rule?

Port installed options are legal in Street. This is what caused the FRS/BRZ dilemma with the TRD option suspension. Same with the protested Mini in STX with a boost altering option (I heard at least).

Section 12: "An item of standard or optional equipment that could have been ordered with the car, installed on the factory production line, and delivered through a dealer in the United States. Port-installed options provided by the manufacturer are considered to be the same as those installed on the factory production line. Dealer-installed options or deletions (except as required by factory directives), no matter how common or what their origin, are not included in this definition. This definition does not allow the updating or backdating of parts."

As the rule is currently written, any/all port installed options are considered standard parts and are therefore legal in Street regardless of their performance impact. If the coilovers were port installed (I think they are dealer installed), they would be legal.

This specific rule is an advantage imported vehicles have over domestics.
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      01-10-2017, 03:31 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSBM5 View Post
Updating earlier guidance from the SCCA. In the November Fastrack, SCCA released the official stock class for 2017 for the M2: B-street.
Ran Sunday and had so much back and forward that it was painful.

At one time I just told them pull all classification and just let me run it, I am not looking to compete just have fun..

Stock its B-Street but I have Eibach springs and Bypass Exhaust so organizers said I would be in STU.

Registered and labeled properly and as I was lining the car up someone from STU complained apparently.

They told me I would be moved to CSP I believe, so I removed classing and was running only numbers.

Then finally organizers came back and said it should be STU.

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      01-10-2017, 04:02 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EL BAN View Post
Ran Sunday and had so much back and forward that it was painful.

At one time I just told them pull all classification and just let me run it, I am not looking to compete just have fun..

Stock its B-Street but I have Eibach springs and Bypass Exhaust so organizers said I would be in STU.

Registered and labeled properly and as I was lining the car up someone from STU complained apparently.

They told me I would be moved to CSP I believe, so I removed classing and was running only numbers.

Then finally organizers came back and said it should be STU.
The exhaust would be fine in B-street unless it changes the cats...as long as it is behind the cats, it's legal afaik.

Springs bump you out of street class into STU as you know. I would have simply told the complainer to protest the car (since according to the rule book, it falls into STU "NOC" - "not otherwise classified 4-seater, turbocharged 2.0-3.1L".)

Unfortunately, without a lot of other class legal work, with a PAX of 0.831 in STU it's not likely to PAX well or be competitive in class. B-street is 0.813.

None of that matters of course since it sounds like you just want to have some fun with the car. Well, how was it?
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      01-10-2017, 04:10 PM   #39
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I'm envious of you guys in warm states with big smooth parking lots. By the time I hit 1200 miles autocross was over for the season

I'm with you. Don't care what they class me as. I'm just there to burn up tires and practice car control.
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      01-10-2017, 04:27 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSBM5 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by EL BAN View Post
Ran Sunday and had so much back and forward that it was painful.

At one time I just told them pull all classification and just let me run it, I am not looking to compete just have fun..

Stock its B-Street but I have Eibach springs and Bypass Exhaust so organizers said I would be in STU.

Registered and labeled properly and as I was lining the car up someone from STU complained apparently.

They told me I would be moved to CSP I believe, so I removed classing and was running only numbers.

Then finally organizers came back and said it should be STU.
The exhaust would be fine in B-street unless it changes the cats...as long as it is behind the cats, it's legal afaik.

Springs bump you out of street class into STU as you know. I would have simply told the complainer to protest the car (since according to the rule book, it falls into STU "NOC" - "not otherwise classified 4-seater, turbocharged 2.0-3.1L".)

Unfortunately, without a lot of other class legal work, with a PAX of 0.831 in STU it's not likely to PAX well or be competitive in class. B-street is 0.813.

None of that matters of course since it sounds like you just want to have some fun with the car. Well, how was it?
Extremely fun.. the car is very predictable. I had pushed hard the one I ran at PCD when I picked up the car.

The cold weather did not help with grip but still was very fun! Hopefully next one weather is hotter and tires sticky!

But this thing handles incredible and the Eibach springs make it feel even more planted!

Best run of the day.. lots of fun

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      01-12-2017, 12:20 AM   #41
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Ha! El Ban I don't know if you noticed me but I was in a white evo ix on the turnpike trying to catch up and get a good look at LBB.

I was planning to run the event but was having spark blow out issues so headed home. Glad you liked the event and hope to catch you in person the next time. MSCC is usually really relaxed I'm surprised someone protested. I'm hoping to eventually be able to autocross an M2 if I can get an allocation. The surface at Lake County Tech is really getting worn down. Pretty slippery in the cold
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      01-12-2017, 12:09 PM   #42
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Quote:
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Ha! El Ban I don't know if you noticed me but I was in a white evo ix on the turnpike trying to catch up and get a good look at LBB.

I was planning to run the event but was having spark blow out issues so headed home. Glad you liked the event and hope to catch you in person the next time. MSCC is usually really relaxed I'm surprised someone protested. I'm hoping to eventually be able to autocross an M2 if I can get an allocation. The surface at Lake County Tech is really getting worn down. Pretty slippery in the cold
How would I not notice your EVO! Looked very clean. I was thinking for sure you were on your way to the event.

I am planning being there on the one scheduled for February so we can definitely have a chat there.

That's what I heard that MSCC is very relaxed and laid back and everyone is great. So I have no idea why the whole back and forward about the classification took place.

I'm thinking they protested initially thinking I would run faster but this is my first event in this car and although I have done road racing and Auto X before it has never been in a RWD car with power like the M2 has. So I was really just out there trying to get a feel of the car but the cold weather wasn't helping.

As soon as I rolled into inspection I had iDrive saying to inflate the tires cause they were too low for over 80mph driving and perform a reset. So after inflating and resetting it tried to recalculate. But it does it while driving. At that time I was already running my heat so it wasn't able to fully reset so I was blind as to temperature at each corner.

I spoke to a couple guys there, one in a Z06 and one in a Pontiac G8, both great talking about cars and they did confirm that the moment to turn off DSC was there since organizers would allow me to swing the car a bit without pulling me. They say they are tolerant with it as long as someone is not trying to drift the car the whole layout.

But being new to the car I was running nannies on.

Hope you make it out to the next one!
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      04-08-2017, 06:53 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eimsteim View Post
FRS TRD Limited edition came out which allowed all FRS cars to update/backdate to the suspension that was offered on the limited edition car. Not because it was a port installed options.

Mini coopers have the option of a JCW package from the factory allowing cars to update/backdate their suspensions to use those components.

If BMW releases a M2 Trim level or Package (Not CS) that includes the M adjustable suspension then they will be allowed. If you have to customize your order from a dealer with those pieces installed either at port or at the dealership then they are not allowed in Street classes. Quick way to get your answer on newer cars, if you can go to the webpage and spec out the car before you get to "accessories" then it's legal in street. If you click on it as an accessory or a write in when you go to the dealership and order the car then it is not allowed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by autoxtoomuch View Post
First post, long time lurker.

Are you talking about a new rule?

Port installed options are legal in Street. This is what caused the FRS/BRZ dilemma with the TRD option suspension. Same with the protested Mini in STX with a boost altering option (I heard at least).

Section 12: "An item of standard or optional equipment that could have been ordered with the car, installed on the factory production line, and delivered through a dealer in the United States. Port-installed options provided by the manufacturer are considered to be the same as those installed on the factory production line. Dealer-installed options or deletions (except as required by factory directives), no matter how common or what their origin, are not included in this definition. This definition does not allow the updating or backdating of parts."

As the rule is currently written, any/all port installed options are considered standard parts and are therefore legal in Street regardless of their performance impact. If the coilovers were port installed (I think they are dealer installed), they would be legal.

This specific rule is an advantage imported vehicles have over domestics.
Now that there is an official option package for the car (M Performance) which includes the suspension, where does the car fall? Still in B-street? This is unique in that the cars are all non-customizable and come exactly as spec'ed by the manufacturer - so I would think this negates any question about the car being customized by the dealer or ordering system.

EDIT: just sent a question in to the Solo Events Board, so we'll see what they say.
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      04-11-2017, 03:44 PM   #44
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Also just checking stock the car falls under B Street right?
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