[Artemis]

The time now has really come to put this sensitive issue to rest again 'until further notice'.

Taking my car for a spin tomorrow, regardless of its deck design. As Suzanne Vega sings in her "Language" song: "Words are just the crust of the meaning with realms underneath". Same goes for the engine cover of my car.

[ashburyn54]

Originally Posted by the_phew

N55 has an open deck, so it'll always be limited in terms of boost. B-series engines are closed deck, which is the ideal configuration for aluminum motorsports engines with high boost. Porsche, Subie STi rally racers, etc are all closed deck aluminum engines. There are always compromises; closed deck designs are more expensive and generally require a bigger cooling system.

N->B wasn't just about improving NVH and efficiency; they are fundamentally more robust engines thanks to the move from open->closed deck.

So wrong lol on many accounts

[ashburyn54]

Originally Posted by the_phew

This article details all of the differences between the N55 and B58:

http://youwheel.com/home/2016/03/27/...ine-6-cylinder

Tl;dr-N55 was designed to control costs, B58 makes fewer concessions to keep costs down

The standard b58 is not a more capable/more reliable engine. The cooling alone/oil sump and pan is something that people like you seem to not care about. You read spec sheets then spew your "knowledge" everywhere.

[DivideBYZero]

Jesus, this thread is pretty tiring.

[Corinne]

Originally Posted by DivideBYZero

Jesus, this thread is pretty tiring.

I prefer this thread when there are some vicious comments and insults being thrown around - it makes for a more entertaining read.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by Corinne

I prefer this thread when there are some vicious comments and insults being thrown around - it makes for a more entertaining read.

Et voilà...

[Robin_NL]

For a few seasons now they have been racing the M235i Racing cup with the N55 engine in it. What should say that?



From the 2015 season(afaik) they have a huge rear spoiler on the boot/trunk.

Cheers
Robin

[patrickoccasionallydrives]

Originally Posted by the_phew

Wow, I've seen people debate Trump vs. Clinton in a more civil manner than this "deck" kerfuffle. I didn't intend to start a sh!tstorm; just fishing for insider info.

In any case, the N engines clatter like a John Deere tractor at idle, while the B engines just purr. That's reason enough to prefer them; fuel consumption and possible durability aside.

i have owned a n55 for over 3 years now, no rattle or strange noises at all. even when the valvetronic motor malfunctioned, i was still able to drive to the dealer with no strange noises. in my opinion the n55 is a pretty refined engine at stock configurations.

[ried]

Since when is "clatter" something that disqualifies an M car? The S54 is one of the most loved engines of all time, and that thing sounds like you're shaking a coffee can full of nails. The N55 sounds silky smooth by comparison.

[Franzino]

Originally Posted by chris719

Agreed. The B58 would probably be a barely noticeable upgrade. The S55 would be much more substantial, but can they still preserve the balance of the car? A few reviews seem to think the huge power and throttle mapping in the S55 are part of what makes the M4's rear end "difficult".

I'm thinking the same....

[kiysersosae]

I wouldn't be surprised if all they do is change the turbo and increase hp by 15 or 20 and lighten the car in places. It doesn't really need a new engine, or more power (well maybe a bit more would be nicel) , it's so usable with what it has, but it definitely needs to loose about 70kg. I would take no power bump on the n55 and a 70-100kg weight loss any day, that would make the car a different animal

[zenmaster]

Originally Posted by kiysersosae

I wouldn't be surprised if all they do is change the turbo and increase hp by 15 or 20 and lighten the car in places.

For the LCI? No way. Can't reduce that much weight without losing strength. I don't see them raising the price substantially, or going backwards in emmisions or fuel economy for an LCI. They'd need a whole new platform.

[ric124]

Originally Posted by the_phew

N55 has an open deck, so it'll always be limited in terms of boost. B-series engines are closed deck, which is the ideal configuration for aluminum motorsports engines with high boost. Porsche, Subie STi rally racers, etc are all closed deck aluminum engines. There are always compromises; closed deck designs are more expensive and generally require a bigger cooling system.

N->B wasn't just about improving NVH and efficiency; they are fundamentally more robust engines thanks to the move from open->closed deck.

This is found on BMWusa.com

[ric124]

Originally Posted by patrickoccasionallydrives

i have owned a n55 for over 3 years now, no rattle or strange noises at all. even when the valvetronic motor malfunctioned, i was still able to drive to the dealer with no strange noises. in my opinion the n55 is a pretty refined engine at stock configurations.

I also owned a f30 with the N55 for over 4 years and I can tell you the N55 in the M2 behaves completely different. The M2's N55 likes to be rev'd higher and to stay in the higher rpm range. With all the changes BMW did to the N55 they should have never kept the name.

For those who have already driven an M2 I would say go and test drive the M240i and you can do your own comparison.

[MMMBRAP]

Originally Posted by Levente_CSL

the LCI will be the M2 CS. as for the normal m2 the only facelift it will get are the led lights nothing else.

That's some funny shit.

You talking to your "exclusive BMW dealership" buddy again?

[M5XDRIVE]

Originally Posted by Artemis

[*]F87 M2 started production in 2015 (SOP) and production is expected to end in 2020 (EOP); it is equally expected to adopt the 2er LCI in MY2018; [/LIST]Attachment 1529041

Attachment 1529042

The website you used to get the M2 production life cycle of (2015-2020). Is that an official 100% reliable source? I went to the website and I wasn't sure.

Thank you.

[zenmaster]

Originally Posted by mangofreshh

The website you used to get the M2 production life cycle of (2015-2020). Is that an official 100% reliable source? I went to the website and I wasn't sure.

Thank you.

It's not 100% reliable as it did not come from BMW. But historically it's been reliable. This has already been pointed out in this thread.

[Euromeister]

News from BMWBLOG


The BMW 2 Series was launched in late 2013 which means that next year it will be turning four, the age where BMW usually likes to infuse new energy into its models. And they will include the BMW M2 in this mix, according to our sources inside Munich. That?s a bit unexpected as the M car was launched considerably later down the line compared to the standard 2 Series.

However, you shouldn?t expect big changes to happen as the German manufacturer and the clients themselves are quite happy with the car already. Most likely, we?ll see the introduction of a new front and rear-end design, mostly focused on the headlights and taillights. Chances are we?ll even get to see some more new tech thrown into the mix, as the 2 Series doesn?t get the full spectrum of Bavarian innovations at the moment.
The engines powering the 2 Series models out there are already almost completely part of the modular B-family with the exception of the BMW 220i and the 225d. Those will most likely be upgraded as well to the B48 and B47 units in different power output guises. The 220i will get the same 192 HP unit as the MINI Cooper S, bumping the hp reading by 8 HP while the 225d will have 231 HP.

As for the BMW M2 little is known. The N55 engine is likely to continue on, as BMW rarely upgrades the engine inside M cars once the LCI is launched. However, the M2 is and always was a peculiar model from a couple of points of view. It doesn?t use a BMW Motorsport engine, developed from the ground up, but an enhanced version of the N55. That?s what could force the hand of the management team to move on up to the B58 mill, to comply with changing laws regarding pollution and CO2 emissions. That definitely won?t be a loss for the car as it would gain a bit more torque throughout the rev range.

[Spinnetti]

On Marklines (Industry research site) they don't even show a LCI for the 2 series, and show a refresh to the "CLAR" platform mid way thorough 2019. Interestingly, they show the Z5 in 2018 on a Toyota Platform.... Not saying this site is golden and I see its missing things (no Audi RS or M models called out in the production plan for instance), but refreshes are generally shown.

[zenmaster]

Originally Posted by Spinnetti

On Marklines (Industry research site) they don't even show a LCI for the 2 series, and show a refresh to the "CLAR" platform mid way thorough 2019. Interestingly, they show the Z5 in 2018 on a Toyota Platform.... Not saying this site is golden and I see its missing things (no Audi RS or M models called out in the production plan for instance), but refreshes are generally shown.

1) CLAR and the Toyota colab is very old news.
2) We already know 2-series gets an LCI refresh.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by mangofreshh

The website you used to get the M2 production life cycle of (2015-2020). Is that an official 100% reliable source? I went to the website and I wasn't sure.
Thank you.

Let's keep it to: they are bloody well informed (and publish their info in German [more complete, showing for example also info and pictures of every BMW production facility] and English).

Surf a bit around on that particular website featuring very detailed BMW info since 1928 and judge for yourself.

[Jadar]

Originally Posted by RPM2-85

Its closed deck, get over it. No way they would allow a car make 400lb ft of torque to the wheels stock without having a closed deck. Do some critical thinking buddy....

And your also an idiot if you dont think they make 400 to the wheels stock.....

Show proof...simple as that. Post the link or BMW engineering referring to it...

Plenty of open deck designed motors out there pushing over 400lbs of tq.

And they don't make 400 tq stock it's 382 to the wheels with overboost on a dynojet on its best day on a cool day. Top gear solutions just dynoed 2 M's, manual and DCT.

Do some reading and research before spouting off and insulting people. You're making yourself look foolish.