[stefan]

Originally Posted by bradleyland

My point is that everyone is entitled to make their own value judgement. Where you went off the rails is framing your argument as logical, and everyone else's as emotional.

You missed my point. If you savagely pursue a value proposition in terms of dollar per performance, that ratio falls apart on the M2 when you look at the M240. So of course you're going to need put value on things like looks, feel, eg subjective or emotional aspects.

Like for example take any track where the two cars have fairly competed. Divide price into lap time and you'll find that the 240 is a better proposition in this aspect. As someone who recognizes this but still has an 18 M2 on order, I'm just trying to emphasize the m2 is more than it's performance.

I don't personally buy my cars on my performance. Definitely a more complex formula.

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by stefan

You missed my point. If you savagely pursue a value proposition in terms of dollar per performance, that ratio falls apart on the M2 when you look at the M240. So of course you're going to need put value on things like looks, feel, eg subjective or emotional aspects.

Like for example take any track where the two cars have fairly competed. Divide price into lap time and you'll find that the 240 is a better proposition in this aspect. As someone who recognizes this but still has an 18 M2 on order, I'm just trying to emphasize the m2 is more than it's performance.

I don't personally buy my cars on my performance. Definitely a more complex formula.

I didn't miss your point. You pretty plainly stated that the "logical" choice was the M240i, and the M2 was an "emotional" choice.

You could just say, "Yeah, that might have been unfair," but instead you're over here dropping savage value propositions on us.

Bottom line is that purchasing a car is a subjective experience, so whatever criteria you have arrived at for determining value proposition is going to be influenced by your own priorities.

Buy whatever car you want, just stop labeling one value framework logical and the others emotional. They're all logical when applying an individual's priorities.

[Ramos]

Originally Posted by STK

Huh? I can only assume you hit reply to the wrong post. My point is that you -- an experienced track driver -- would be faster in a stock M2 than a stock M235. You said as much. My other point was that an inexperienced driver would not be faster because the capabilities of both cars would be well beyond their skill level. I'm frickin' agreeing with you.

I guess I mis-read your intended meaning.
I thought you were saying that I must not be able to extract more from the M2 than a M235 on track because I am defending the M235

My bad

[DoggieHowser]

So I finally picked up my M2 today - and I have been driving the missus' 125i MSport for the last couple of months. The M Sports package is the same as the one in the M135i (same M Sports brakes and same fixed M Sports suspension, not the Adaptive one that is standard in the M140i in Australia).

Obviously the power train is not the same as the M240i but the suspension and chassis tuning on the M Sport suspension on an M Sports car is totally not the same as the one on the M2. The M2's steering feel even in Comfort feels different and the M2 feels more planted, more assured - even at peak hour commutes, the whole character of the car is different.

IMHO.

[stren]

+1, I drove M2 and M240i 6MTs back to back. The feel of the 240 to me is a toned down M2. More comfy, easier, softer but with the same effective speed on the road. But for me, the same reasons that would make me want the 240 are even stronger for the M2. For me when I price up a 240 it's essentially the same as the M2. Even a 230 ends up close enough that I wouldn't bother.

For me the decision isn't M2 or M240i, because the price is so similar the choice is obvious for me. The harder choice is a M2 or a lightly used m235i (preferably with LSD & mppk and mpe) at 60% of the cost. There is no way I'd pay full price for a new M240i at a similar price to the M2 (unless I needed a car quickly). Then it comes down to higher upfront cost and higher resale and all the benefits of a new car vs lower upfront cost. Personally I think the resale of the M2 would be high enough that the cost of ownership is similar or better - but it can be hard to persuade a spouse that a 55K car is actually cheaper than a 30K car.

[termigni]

only reason I'd buy a M240 over an M2 is for AWD feature. not that I'd want an AWD in an Ultimate Driving Machine.
For my wife yes M240 would be the car. but she likes SUVs and that's another story.

I drove a few 645i RWD and AWD back to back at Monticello Track and the difference in performance on track is marginal, RWD being significantly better than AWD.

Like the above post, M2 will retain it's resale value much higher than an M240 in 3~7+ years just like any other BMW M models over its series production cars.

[9t2hoo]

Originally Posted by stren

+1, I drove M2 and M240i 6MTs back to back. The feel of the 240 to me is a toned down M2. More comfy, easier, softer but with the same effective speed on the road. But for me, the same reasons that would make me want the 240 are even stronger for the M2. For me when I price up a 240 it's essentially the same as the M2. Even a 230 ends up close enough that I wouldn't bother.

For me the decision isn't M2 or M240i, because the price is so similar the choice is obvious for me. The harder choice is a M2 or a lightly used m235i (preferably with LSD & mppk and mpe) at 60% of the cost. There is no way I'd pay full price for a new M240i at a similar price to the M2 (unless I needed a car quickly). Then it comes down to higher upfront cost and higher resale and all the benefits of a new car vs lower upfront cost. Personally I think the resale of the M2 would be high enough that the cost of ownership is similar or better - but it can be hard to persuade a spouse that a 55K car is actually cheaper than a 30K car.

I know your post is from 5 months ago, but I couldn't resist responding. I negotiated a deal on an M2 and a M240i at the same time. The M240i had a sticker price of slightly more than $53,000 and they offered to sell it to me for $46,700. They would not budge on the sticker price of the M2, which was $56,500. In the end, that $9,800 difference pushed me towards the M240i. That and the fact that the potholes here are brutal. The softer suspension on the M240i is more livable for me (and this comes from a guy who drove on Koni sport yellows for 9 years).

[ShelJW]

Originally Posted by 9t2hoo

The M240i had a sticker price of slightly more than $53,000 and they offered to sell it to me for $46,700. They would not budge on the sticker price of the M2, which was $56,500. In the end, that $9,800 difference pushed me towards the M240i.

Interesting post!

My son (I call him "The Enabler"), when pushing me into ordering a 2018 M2, pointed out that if you add all of the features that come with the M2 onto an M240i, the price difference isn't very much!

And while that's true, what he didn't mention (and I didn't really think about) is that the dealer will be willing to negotiate down on an M240i, but won't budge on an M2!

That being said, I did drive an M2 at the dealership, then immediately test drove an M240i, and while the M240i is a wonderful car, it does have a very different feel from the M2... the M2 feels like it wants to take off! Drive it even at 35-40mph, and you hear the engine and feel the road... it just has a very different feel!

I'm looking for a Sunday or weekend car, not an everyday driver, and the M2 fits the bill much better then the M240, for ME... everyone is different!

I rented an M2 for two days from Turo, and let me tell you... I did NOT want to return that car! Took it onto the canyons here in Los Angeles, and it's just a total blast, instilling confidence in the driver with every mile!

[akkando]

Originally Posted by 9t2hoo

I know your post is from 5 months ago, but I couldn't resist responding. I negotiated a deal on an M2 and a M240i at the same time. The M240i had a sticker price of slightly more than $53,000 and they offered to sell it to me for $46,700. They would not budge on the sticker price of the M2, which was $56,500. In the end, that $9,800 difference pushed me towards the M240i. That and the fact that the potholes here are brutal. The softer suspension on the M240i is more livable for me (and this comes from a guy who drove on Koni sport yellows for 9 years).

How much softer is the suspension in the 240?

[RAM_F30_F87]

From December 2017 Roundel Magazine M2 vs. M240i article
https://view.imirus.com/290/document/12787/page/75

[krizze]

http://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...php?p=22459738



i had a chance to drive the 240i recently and thought i'd share my thoughts, might interest some on this thread

[Excezz]

My M2 cost me USD211,000 where i live.......*drops mic*

[velociti]

Originally Posted by Excezz

My M2 cost me USD211,000 where i live.......*drops mic*

K.

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by Excezz

My M2 cost me USD211,000 where i live.......*drops mic*

*picks up mic*

Sir...

Siiiiir...

I think you dropped this.

[champignon]

Originally Posted by Excezz

My M2 cost me USD211,000 where i live.......*drops mic*

And then, don't they force you in Singapore to get rid of cars once they are 10 years old? Or has that changed?

[Lucky1]

Originally Posted by bradleyland

*picks up mic*

Sir...

Siiiiir...

I think you dropped this.

Definitely don't want to be leaving those behind. I'd hate to see the cost of microphones there too.

[CP911]

I could afford the M2 just as easily as the m240i, but I went with the latter. A RWD/MT stripper w/ moonroof delete... I felt there was more value at just over $40k vs. paying $55k for the M2 given its dated engine tech and limited color options. m240i has adaptive suspension (I do drive on roads mostly), B58 engine, and it comes in red!! For crying out loud, if I'm buying a sports coupe, I want it in a color other than black, white, or gray! (Or LBB...really do not like LBB either. Love so many other BMW blues, but LBB is certainly not one of them). They couldn't even give us a silver, red, or yellow with the M2...really? Did they even want us to buy these? Nope...BMW Marketing did not.

Anyhow, I have a feeling I'll be enjoying my m240i quite a bit for what it is. The only way I'll be moving up to a M2 is if it somehow by a miracle gets a S58 power plant at some point and more M3-esque fender flares while we're at it.

[Orchard6]

Originally Posted by CP911

I could afford the M2 just as easily as the m240i, but I went with the latter. A RWD/MT stripper w/ moonroof delete... I felt there was more value at just over $40k vs. paying $55k for the M2 given its dated engine tech and limited color options. m240i has adaptive suspension (I do drive on roads mostly), B58 engine, and it comes in red!! For crying out loud, if I'm buying a sports coupe, I want it in a color other than black, white, or gray! (Or LBB...really do not like LBB either. Love so many other BMW blues, but LBB is certainly not one of them). They couldn't even give us a silver, red, or yellow with the M2...really? Did they even want us to buy these? Nope...BMW Marketing did not.

Anyhow, I have a feeling I'll be enjoying my m240i quite a bit for what it is. The only way I'll be moving up to a M2 is if it somehow by a miracle gets a S58 power plant at some point and more M3-esque fender flares while we're at it.

We get it.
You can’t afford the M2!!

[Dav3]

Originally Posted by CP911

I could afford the M2 just as easily as the m240i, but I went with the latter. A RWD/MT stripper w/ moonroof delete... I felt there was more value at just over $40k vs. paying $55k for the M2 given its dated engine tech and limited color options. m240i has adaptive suspension (I do drive on roads mostly), B58 engine, and it comes in red!! For crying out loud, if I'm buying a sports coupe, I want it in a color other than black, white, or gray! (Or LBB...really do not like LBB either. Love so many other BMW blues, but LBB is certainly not one of them). They couldn't even give us a silver, red, or yellow with the M2...really? Did they even want us to buy these? Nope...BMW Marketing did not.

Anyhow, I have a feeling I'll be enjoying my m240i quite a bit for what it is. The only way I'll be moving up to a M2 is if it somehow by a miracle gets a S58 power plant at some point and more M3-esque fender flares while we're at it.

I never will understand how people don’t realize that shitting on the car in the specific car sub is just dumb and a waste of time

[PackPride85]

Originally Posted by CP911

I could afford the M2 just as easily as the m240i, but I went with the latter. A RWD/MT stripper w/ moonroof delete... I felt there was more value at just over $40k vs. paying $55k for the M2 given its dated engine tech and limited color options. m240i has adaptive suspension (I do drive on roads mostly), B58 engine, and it comes in red!! For crying out loud, if I'm buying a sports coupe, I want it in a color other than black, white, or gray! (Or LBB...really do not like LBB either. Love so many other BMW blues, but LBB is certainly not one of them). They couldn't even give us a silver, red, or yellow with the M2...really? Did they even want us to buy these? Nope...BMW Marketing did not.

Anyhow, I have a feeling I'll be enjoying my m240i quite a bit for what it is. The only way I'll be moving up to a M2 is if it somehow by a miracle gets a S58 power plant at some point and more M3-esque fender flares while we're at it.

Sounds like the M240 is more for you anyway. More concerned about the color and "engine tech" vs the difference in how they drive.....which is significant.

[CP911]

Originally Posted by lopm2

I never will understand how people don’t realize that shitting on the car in the specific car sub is just dumb and a waste of time

TBH, I didn't realize what sub-forum I was in. Man some of you get so butthurt over nothing. Not trying to rain on anyone's M2 parade. Just sharing my thoughts and opinions on the matter since that is the topic of this thread, no? M2 is great car. Just not a car I felt was worth the money. Would rather buy cheaper car now and just enjoy in case a truly enticing M2 variant pops up later or another P-car for that matter...can always trade up!

[Kothar]

You do not need awd. The m2 with snow tires will go through the mess no prob. Last 3 weeks with tons of snow around this thing can handle it. I've even driven Ontario's 401 with 20cm if snow cooming down and it cleared it all no issue. This car is great!