04-23-2017, 05:21 PM | #45 |
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I have a month or so to decide on the DCT vs. manual question, before my allocation comes up. For the dozens of cars I've owned in my life, I've always chosen manuals - the only exceptions being a couple of real estate Buicks, a handful of family hauler SUVs (and one minivan!), plus an early GTI DSG the dealer bought back after a month because he couldn't keep it running. But all of my fun cars have been manuals.
This time around, I thought it was time to try something different - a paddle-shift, high-tech DCT - and I've been really intrigued with the thought of exploring performance driving with one. But then I remember the joys of barreling into a turn on the edge of sanity, braking hard, blipping the throttle and uncorking the perfect, orgasmic, 3-2 downshift. Can you do that with a DCT? |
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04-23-2017, 05:25 PM | #46 | |
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04-23-2017, 05:33 PM | #47 | |
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04-23-2017, 05:50 PM | #48 | |
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I see a lot of people get completely defensive about DCTs even though they haven't ever tried a manual transmission car. I think we should all try and teach as many people as possible about using manuals so they at least know how it feels. Beyond that, if they still want to get a DCT or any other auto transmission, it would be an informed and correct decision on their part. |
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04-23-2017, 06:10 PM | #49 | |
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04-23-2017, 06:30 PM | #50 | |
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04-23-2017, 06:49 PM | #51 |
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I have driven a manual since age 16 when I got a 1975 Fiat 124 spider!
And I grew up in NYC!!!! Since then EVERY one of my cars have been manual. I do have automatic in my stable but each of my primary daily drivers have been manuals for the past 43 years. I am 59! Each of my three kids has a manual vehicle! I can drive an automatic but I am always reaching for the third pedal! I know I am no longer relevant when I prefer my cars to have keys, dials for temperature and radio, and a THIRD pedal! My M2 MT...only 1 of 3.. third pedal.. I will take it. The keyless concept....I am having a hard time! For BMW stating 20% for M2 production???? I will look at the 2017 M2 production... for North America Model year 2016 40% chose manual. I can't believe it is much different for MY 2017 but I will check several hundred 2017 production tranny options and report back. |
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04-23-2017, 06:49 PM | #52 |
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Great Thread.
I took what was available and would have been happy with either. I find it amazing what people still do with older cars. There are quite a few RS6 drivers who have DIY swapped their 5 speed autos for 6 speed manual transmission. There is a guy who makes the 'kit' with the mounting adapter needed to put a 6 speed from the older S4's on the RS6. As long as there are car enthusiasts around someone is going to figure out how to swap the new fancy auto for an old fashioned manual transmission and make it work right. As far as fast shifting is concerned, from what I can recall, the sequential shifter in the Ferrari's is not a dual clutch setup but still shifts faster than ANYTHING out there. The ZF 8 speed in my 2013 A8L shifted pretty fast compared to my RS6 2003 technology slush box. I don't see Autonomous car's 'taking over' for at least another 100 years. There will be a surge in interest and then the problems will put it back a few decades. The transmission time will involve a mix of Autonomous with real drivers and real weather and real road issues, etc. Enjoy the ride. Mike
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04-23-2017, 07:04 PM | #53 |
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It only took about 2 days before using the paddle shifters on my 2014 M5 grew tiresome. After that, I rarely bothered with them. Sold the car after 9 months, due in large part to unhappiness with the DCT. -ir
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04-23-2017, 08:02 PM | #54 | |
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If 40% of the 2016 M2s were really manual, there is still hope that the M2 CS could be equipped with a stick. I just hope BMW sees it. If not there will be people who will start looking for used/new p-cars. |
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04-23-2017, 08:30 PM | #55 | |
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I'm sure I'll get called a manual snob, but I'm not trying to be. If you like 2 pedals, that's awesome, it's just not for me. |
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04-23-2017, 09:56 PM | #56 |
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It's very encouraging to see that there are still so many ardent fans of the manual transmission. I respect that preferences vary, but to me a manual transmission is a must in any car that I buy for myself. If the M2 did not come with a manual transmission, I would not have ordered one. To me, no matter how great a car is, if it does not have a manual transmission I will find the driving experience slightly lacking. This is just my opinion, and i do not expect everyone to agree.
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04-23-2017, 11:11 PM | #58 |
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I have owned nothing but manuals for 25 years and if I can, that will be my sole choice. It's not about faster shifts, 0-60... it's the connection to the car that pulls me in.
It's not that I look down upon an automatic transmission. Every time I'm in a loaner or rental, it's an auto. Sometimes I get a BMW loaner with a sports package and a couple times I got a 335is DCT. It's fine... I drive it, commute, appreciate a little less effort but I feel I'm floating in the car, not driving it. Even in my lucky opportunities to drive a Lambo Gallardo, Porsche Turbo S and a couple choice exotics... I still get back into my car and feel that connection again. I have come close to going to the other side, but I always err on the side of caution and choose a manual coupe every time. I have the same affinity for coupes vs a 4 door. I'm not always going to to be drawn to practicality or convenience. That's me... it's not a rule nor does it apply to everyone. Drive what you can afford, what makes you smile and appreciate how lucky you are to be passionate about what you drive... whatever that is. Long live the manual! I can dream right? |
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04-23-2017, 11:20 PM | #59 |
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Wow lots of essays being written here. Passionate subject. Here's my last one involving some nice fuzzy math. Thus far 11,500 M2's have gone out the door with supposedly 20% manuals. That's 2300 cars with a retail value of $53,000 (yes I'm using US) or $121 million. That's nothing to sneeze at. If BMW wants to stupidly assume those people will migrate to DCT because they decide to unilaterally eliminate manual without asking the customer they are sadly mistaken. I for one would be out.
Porsche offers every sports car they make with both. The uproar after the PDK only GT3 taught them a lesson they won't soon forget and they responded. If BMW wants to play this idiotic game then I'm a Porsche guy it's as simple as that. If they wanna release CS models and GTS models as DCT only they should think twice. By the way why does everyone treat Ferrari like they can do no wrong and never call them out on their love affair with the dual clutch? If nobody else will say it especially journalists then I will. It's a disgrace that a Ferrari with a manual transmission cannot be purchased today. |
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04-24-2017, 04:51 AM | #60 | |||||
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Drive what you personally like most. Don't let your choice depend on what others prefer. It's your car. Most of the time you will like the transmission you have and sometimes, depending on circumstances and mood, you wish you had the other transmission. Anyway, despite differences regarding concept and driving feel, both are 'win'.
Two posts from the past explaining why my vote goes to 6MT (additional factor: grown up with manual transmissions). Quote:
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04-24-2017, 05:37 AM | #61 | |
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I hate to say it, but 20% was a much lower number than I expected for a so called enthusiast model. It's now time for me to start planning on how to get my hands on an LCI M2 at the end of its life cycle |
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04-24-2017, 06:51 AM | #62 | |
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04-24-2017, 06:55 AM | #63 | |
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04-24-2017, 07:24 AM | #64 | |
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Between all my Ms, my avg mileage is something like 105k miles. It's already stressful enough to think about what's going to break (cooling system, VANOS, rod bearings....). It's nice to not worry too much about the trans |
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04-24-2017, 08:18 AM | #65 | |
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04-24-2017, 08:40 AM | #66 | ||||
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