[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by Gibson6594

My advice to everyone who feels like the OP is not to buy it. Move on and buy something you are sure you will love.

And let me know if you have an allocation lower than 5 at a tri-state dealership.

That sounds like a future M2 owner

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by G8rGrl

Genuine question: People keep saying the above, no one is saying exactly how. Can you explain some more?

Yes, the C450 AMG Coupe is not the sportscar that is the M2. It is closer in size to the M4. So it is bigger and "not M" but none of us know the difference in the driving experience between the two because none of us have driven either car yet. We just know the driving experience will be different. The C450 AMG coupe will be released at almost the same time as the M2. The pricing will be close....except the C450 Coupe allows people to choose and pay for all the options they want. Just like the AMG CLA45 has tons of options to choose from (I would never buy the CLA45).

So the only way for anyone to decide is by driving both. The M2 will be "stiffer" and "more sporty" and "more track ready". But how much more?

During a test drive: "Am I having more fun in this M2? How MUCH more fun? Is the 'extra M2 fun' worth not getting to choose and pay for options I want and options I can afford? Is the C450 way less fun, or just 10% less fun?" No one can really decide these trade-offs, personal preferences, fun factor, butt dyno, etc. until they drive the cars. Just like people who choose manual over the "faster" DCT simply because they like manual and they don't care about tenths of a second in races and lap times because rowing their own gears is more valuable to them.

So until we all get to drive the cars, can you share more details about your comment?

Let's say this another way ....

If you are waiting for an M2 test drive. Then it's more than likely you won't get one.

If you aren't in line at a local dealer now, you should be.

While what you say has SOME merit , there are many vehicles that people buy without a test drive.

How many people do you think got to test drive a hellcat ? How many people drove a Cayman GT4 before they got one ? How about a Ford Raptor several years ago?

The car will be released at the auto show soon.
The next thing that will happen is the PRESS will get cars and make comparison tests. After BOTH of those things happen, there will be MORE people in line for this car, not less.

Those people will be newer to the marque, won't care about mirrors, and won't give a crap that the motor isn't an " S" motor ,
and will see that this is the only RWD sports car in the price range that actually has power, great handling , rear wheel drive , good looks and also some refinement. If you want arguably better looks and MORE refinement then go get a Mercedes! If you want more power and LESS refinement then go get a C7 or a Mustang (shudder!). And if you want the same amount of refinement with a higher price and less room, then get a Cayman.


If you are looking for something to do before the press release go look up what was said about the 46k BMW 1M in comparison to the 76k Porsche Cayman R In tests 4-5 years ago.

If you still have doubts, and still don't think you should be in line with your deposit ready ... tell me the last BMW M car that was an absolute FLOP.

finally, if you want a test drive of The 2 series chassis then go drive a 235 or 228 and compare to the comparison models that you are thinking of. It should be just as apparent whether or not you are a 2 series or CLK owner from driving the BOTTOM of the line cars as it will be from driving the TOP of the line cars.

[MR.]

Originally Posted by G8rGrl

Genuine question: People keep saying the above, no one is saying exactly how. Can you explain some more?

Yes, the C450 AMG Coupe is not the sportscar that is the M2. It is closer in size to the M4. So it is bigger and "not M" but none of us know the difference in the driving experience between the two because none of us have driven either car yet. We just know the driving experience will be different. The C450 AMG coupe will be released at almost the same time as the M2. The pricing will be close....except the C450 Coupe allows people to choose and pay for all the options they want. Just like the AMG CLA45 has tons of options to choose from (I would never buy the CLA45).

So the only way for anyone to decide is by driving both. The M2 will be "stiffer" and "more sporty" and "more track ready". But how much more?

During a test drive: "Am I having more fun in this M2? How MUCH more fun? Is the 'extra M2 fun' worth not getting to choose and pay for options I want and options I can afford? Is the C450 way less fun, or just 10% less fun?" No one can really decide these trade-offs, personal preferences, fun factor, butt dyno, etc. until they drive the cars. Just like people who choose manual over the "faster" DCT simply because they like manual and they don't care about tenths of a second in races and lap times because rowing their own gears is more valuable to them.

So until we all get to drive the cars, can you share more details about your comment?

M2 is in the class A45 / CLA 45 AMG when it comes to size and abilities.

C450 AMG is in an between model, like the M235i, a mix between comfort and sportiness. You could compare it to the 340i. It is not a fully capable AMG. So it will not have the full AMG set up or engine like the C63 AMG.

So first of all comparing both cars means noting they are different classes, and position wise in each class they are placed differently. The C450 is the model underneath the C63 AMG, while the M2 is the full bread M car in the 2-series.

The M2 is the C63 in the class of the C450 (C-Class). And the C450 is the M235i in the class of M2 (2-series). The perspective of the cars is different. The M2 is way more track orientated and sporty than the C450, which will be a much more comfortable but potent cruiser.

Just look at the spec... Compare suspensions, differentials, steering racks, engine set ups, interior specs, position with regards to options, etc... It is an easy comparison. If you want comfort buy a 340i, want to hoon that M2 around every single corner and buy new rear tires every 6 months, get a M2.

MR

[swagon]

TL;DR wait until you see it with your eyes.

[BMW444]

Originally Posted by E82135i

Hi all, as you can tell from my user name, I am coming from 135i background.

After my accident in 2014, 135i has been gone. It was a superb experience

So instead of getting another car, I decided to drive a car that my wife use to drive, Mini Cooper S (manual). It was to wait for the M2!

However, now that we have a good idea of the price range and how it will look, both the design and performance, I must say that I am disappointed.

What am I disappointed about this fabulous machine? Well, mainly the design of both exterior and interior. Not so much on interior but mind as well say something about it.

Exterior: I feel like M2 does not have something significant as an M car. 1M was very distinguishable from 135is, 135i, and 128i. The more I look at M2, I really can't tell a difference from M235i. Yes, there is bigger intake, Yes, it is much wider. But from the pictures... it is very hard to tell there is significant difference.

Interior: I really do not have any complains about interior design but to the funcitons(?). I recently read a thread regarding to M2 will not have the M buttons. Well, what the hell? Why not? Yes, M engineering team can preset a car better far beyond my ability but why??? Isn't this one of what makes M unique?

I am no expert on cars... it is just my opinion.

I am leaning towards getting C450 AMG Coupe. Performance might not be comparable but the quality of it attracts me.

What do you guys think? Am I the only one thats been looking at M2 and now looking elsewhere?

I have a M235i and from the pictures of the M2 not really much different although seeing one in the flesh may change my mind

[KevinM]

To the OP: clearly you are not the only one.

I think that the M2 will be instantly identifiable from the M235i, much as the M3/4 are to their 3 and 4 series counterparts. Yes, yes, I know about the mirrors. The front air intake, increased width and quad exhausts are more than enough. Personally, I like Q-ships for my DD and so the less identifiable it is the more I like it. For me M is about the driving experience, not showing everyone else that I have an M car.

I'm assuming you are not in a hurry since we won't even see them over here until next spring and even then the initial year's allotment will likely be difficult to obtain. So you have time to actually see the car and make a decision. There are certainly many good alternatives these days. Except if you demand a manual transmission, as I do. Then the list shrinks quite a bit.

[LDSM]

I just posted some side by side pics of the M2 vs M235

For those thinking the M2 is not distinguishable over the M235 are wrong, the car definitely has presence, even in the pics it's hard to tell but in person the M2 is much more aggressive


http://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1200306

[Lt1camaro]

Guys I've found a sub 2k mileage 1M for sale. Should i pull the trigger on it or should I wait for the m2?

[Yeineken]

I have to agree. I was seriously considering trading in the 135i M w/o nav for an M2. But after the release and my initial excitement settled I'm leaning starting to look into other options as my next car. The M2 is great. But its just not ticking the right boxes for me.

Call me old school even tho Im only 24. But the new technology in these cars just turns me off.

[KevinM]

Originally Posted by Lt1camaro

Guys I've found a sub 2k mileage 1M for sale. Should i pull the trigger on it or should I wait for the m2?

Depends on a few things, including if you want or need the car now and how you will feel when you actually see and/or test drive the M2 if you purchase the 1M. I had a similar offer from a friend to buy his 1M - and I loved the car. However, I am not in a hurry, was definitely curious about the M2 and couldn't bring myself to pay above sticker on a 3 year old car (he was selling for $60K, which was worth it based on market value and condition).

GL

[Bimmed Out]

Originally Posted by E82135i

What do you guys think? Am I the only one thats been looking at M2 and now looking elsewhere?

No, you're not. I'm #1 at my dealer and leaning toward passing. I have a GT4 on the way and am #1 at two dealer for the hopeful M2 CSL. The M2 CSL would have to be a complete disaster for me to pass on it and I don't see that happening. I think BMW did a great job with the M4 GTS. If the M4 were not so huge, I would have been a buyer. The M2 looks good and I expect most will be very happy with it, but I just can't get excited about it.

[Tuxedo]

Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster

Let's say this another way ....

If you are waiting for an M2 test drive. Then it's more than likely you won't get one.

If you aren't in line at a local dealer now, you should be.

While what you say has SOME merit , there are many vehicles that people buy without a test drive. ...

finally, if you want a test drive of The 2 series chassis then go drive a 235 or 228 and compare to the comparison models that you are thinking of. It should be just as apparent whether or not you are a 2 series or CLK owner from driving the BOTTOM of the line cars as it will be from driving the TOP of the line cars.

Judging by your signature your pay check is closely tied to the manufacture. I'm not in the market for an M but I think I know business and my observation, 15yrs ago if I wanted to test drive a e46 M3 with anticipation I wasn't threatened with these types of scenarios from BMW. For that reason alone my middle finger feels a little longer as my back turns to the product. I like some of the trade offs BMW has chosen from then to now but this is real money not monopoly money. My buyers remorse is not BMW's if spin it around the block option is replaced with take it in blind faith is all the market BMW wants. The merits of the product should exceed from the buyers point of view and that is what many(not all) M2 market share see... "You want me to buy that on blind faith"?
It appears to me BMW made a better car product then and expect the computer with 4wheels and motor they peddle now to somehow rise in it's place. Sure, its what everybody is doing but not without a test drive.

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by Tuxedo

Judging by your signature your pay check is closely tied to the manufacture. I'm not in the market for an M but I think I know business and my observation, 15yrs ago if I wanted to test drive a e46 M3 with anticipation I wasn't threatened with these types of scenarios from BMW. For that reason alone my middle finger feels a little longer as my back turns to the product. I like some of the trade offs BMW has chosen from then to now but this is real money not monopoly money. My buyers remorse is not BMW's if spin it around the block option is replaced with take it in blind faith is all the market BMW wants. The merits of the product should exceed from the buyers point of view and that is what many(not all) M2 market share see... "You want me to buy that on blind faith"?
It appears to me BMW made a better car product then and expect the computer with 4wheels and motor they peddle now to somehow rise in it's place. Sure, its what everybody is doing but not without a test drive.

it's your call.. your money.. I am simply saying that when the product is unique, rare, or indeed excellent, situations change.
If you as a buyer then refuse to adapt, and perhaps, choose to throw your middle finger? then you will simply miss out. It's your choice to gain or not.

Doesn't matter if it's a car, a house.. a rare gem, or anything of value.

As far as the current BMW sports car lineup... I would wager that the M2 will be the one to have going into the future...as opposed to an F8x... (M4 GTS excepted) . We already know that, while they will are in proximate price ranges... the M2 production will be lower, therefore it will be much rarer than the F8x M3 and M4.. It's not difficult to draw parallels from 1M and e9x to the next generations ...

As far as the quality of the product of BMW in the current market place. Lets check the company record... Can we trust them ?? hmm.. The M135, 1M, M235, E9x M3, F80 M3, and M4, have all been excellent products from BMW... along with a whole lot of other M cars in the past..lessee... 2002 tii.. E30 M3... E36 M3.. Z3 M..Z4M.. E46 M3.. yeah.. I'm firmly convinced that the M2 isn't gonna SUCK so bad that it is a WASTE OF MONEY.

In my opinion, with this history, it's simply folly to expect that BMW will crank out enough M2s " for everyone'" and purposely overinflate the market with the M2.. . I think it will be difficult to get this car... certainly for the first year.. if not for longer.

If you are looking at the current BMW company and lineup through the the jaded lenses of " what BMW used to be " then you are missing out fully on what BMW is today. BMW still represents one of the best overall drivers cars on the market.. and an M car is the best of the brand.

If you haven't noticed .. , there are record numbers of BMW buyers in the market... and while you are locked in on " what BMW used to be " others are going to beat you to a very special car.

Finally.. thank you very much, but I don't collect a paycheck from anything related to BMW. I have owned three M cars and been a BMW CCA member since 1993... I've been a volunteer in the BMW car club since 1997.. I was lucky enough to win a trip in 2010.. and wise enough to tell a lot of people to buy a 1M in 2011..

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by Lt1camaro

Guys I've found a sub 2k mileage 1M for sale. Should i pull the trigger on it or should I wait for the m2?

Instant Classic (1M) vs unknown future classic (M2) is an easy decision that only becomes difficult or muddied if you

1- need a warranty or
2- you are fully happier with the M2 looks all around.
3- you want a DCT or are tech happy and prefer the apps, auto rev matching, and go pro capabilities of the M2..

[Tuxedo]

Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster

As far as the quality of the product of BMW in the current market place. Lets check the company record... Can we trust them ?? hmm.. The M135, 1M, M235, E9x M3, F80 M3, and M4, have all been excellent products from BMW... along with a whole lot of other M cars in the past..lessee... 2002 tii.. E30 M3... E36 M3.. Z3 M..Z4M.. E46 M3.. yeah.. I'm firmly convinced that the M2 isn't gonna SUCK so bad that it is a WASTE OF MONEY.

I won't address everything you say as I don't want to hi-jack this so narrow in a bit, my old vs new BMW experience I'm not able to endorse this claim. Simply put the mechanics of these cars listed ring true but the cars are not mechanics anymore they became computers. If I came to you and said my BMW car seems to barely start and stall when the defrost is on high you would put a new alternator in. If my car wants to stall every once in a while but can't do anything because it didn't trip a code and never gets fixed who do I go to when I can't even go to BMW. Now look at every car in this forum and tell me in researching whether to buy a BMW or not as I just didn't buy an X5 for both the reason software on my e88 and the boards for F15 http://f15.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=970052 every model has a link just like this too.

I am now spending money when out of warranty for what I conclude as software bugs in my car. I didn't have that issue with my e46 or any other car I have ever owned. Fool me once shame on you fool me twice shame on me. Maybe you have had BMW perfection but I haven't and it's not gonna bring any more comfort or peace of mind when buy now and fix it later is frustrating at best a sham at worst. I personally don't feel BMW deserves the respect you give them, BMW rightfully earned that respect from you doesn't mean we all should give it.

Look I'm ready to lust after the M2 but the philosophic mind set a test drive is for the weak is bad business. You have all the BMW knowledge and skill from your signature that I don't. I know if you have a product that stands up as "isn't gonna suck" I'd maybe stand behind it, this thread is started by A BMW faithful clearly worried this may suck... well maybe just a let down anyway and wondering if alone.

I can summarize this whole thread with this statement- If the M2 exceeded expectations neither one of us would need to post. A test drive will tip the scale for E82135i in BMW's favor or MB's favor and you know how I know? sign up on MB's forum and ask if a AMG "isn't gonna suck".

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by Tuxedo

I can summarize this whole thread with this statement- If the M2 exceeded expectations neither one of us would need to post. A test drive will tip the scale for E82135i in BMW's favor or MB's favor and you know how I know? sign up on MB's forum and ask if a AMG "isn't gonna suck".

BMW M has to fly the flag. Releasing a new highly anticipated model with 'good' driving dynamics ain't enough. It must go down the history books as 'excellent', a worthy successor of the infamous 1M.

Otherwise the car press and competition will be merciless in their comments, and any kind of 'meh' stain may haunt the brand for many years to come.

BMW may in the end decide to compromise on some stuff such as mirrors, CF roof, powerdome, seats, etc. for this entry model ///M car (for competitive base price reasons and to not venture too deep into M3/M4 territory), but not on driving dynamics. I trust that BMW M will have done their homework properly and 'deliver' with the M2. They will steer clear from tarnishing the brand reputation.

And for sure test drivers focused on road behavior, whilst keeping the target/purpose in mind, rather than on how the mirrors, hood etc. actually look: "How was the drive Fritz, and how can we perfect it as daily driver ///M car which the target customer sometimes takes to the track ?".

I wouldn't be surprised if BMW arranged for Chris Harris to test drive the M2 next January as one of the first. He already liked the M235i when he drove it for weeks in the past. And, as we all know, his reputation and following is huge. Once his M2 review video hits the interwebs including his hallmark drifts, giggling and straight talk, you'll see that the ghost will be out of the bottle. Those still waiting for a test drive by then, will have to queue. 1M history reloaded.

[tc328]

Originally Posted by E82135i

Hi all, as you can tell from my user name, I am coming from 135i background.

After my accident in 2014, 135i has been gone. It was a superb experience

So instead of getting another car, I decided to drive a car that my wife use to drive, Mini Cooper S (manual). It was to wait for the M2!

However, now that we have a good idea of the price range and how it will look, both the design and performance, I must say that I am disappointed.

What am I disappointed about this fabulous machine? Well, mainly the design of both exterior and interior. Not so much on interior but mind as well say something about it.

Exterior: I feel like M2 does not have something significant as an M car. 1M was very distinguishable from 135is, 135i, and 128i. The more I look at M2, I really can't tell a difference from M235i. Yes, there is bigger intake, Yes, it is much wider. But from the pictures... it is very hard to tell there is significant difference.

Interior: I really do not have any complains about interior design but to the funcitons(?). I recently read a thread regarding to M2 will not have the M buttons. Well, what the hell? Why not? Yes, M engineering team can preset a car better far beyond my ability but why??? Isn't this one of what makes M unique?

I am no expert on cars... it is just my opinion.

I am leaning towards getting C450 AMG Coupe. Performance might not be comparable but the quality of it attracts me.

What do you guys think? Am I the only one thats been looking at M2 and now looking elsewhere?

Go to your 50-60" HDTV and watch videos from youtube....you'll see the difference

Pics on the net will not show

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by Artemis

I wouldn't be surprised if BMW arranged for Chris Harris to test drive the M2 next January as one of the first. He already liked the M235i when he drove it for weeks in the past. And, as we all know, his reputation and following is huge. Once his M2 review video hits the interwebs including his hallmark drifts, giggling and straight talk, you'll see that the ghost will be out of the bottle. Those still waiting for a test drive by then, will have to queue. 1M history reloaded.

For the record: back in 2014, CH got an M235i 6MT loaner for several months.

Some of his M235i conclusions:

"Do we end up with a baby M3 ? I'm not sure we do. Because it still doesn't feel quite as connected and aggressive as an ///M car, but it's mighty impressive. It's agile, it's very fast."
"In terms of personality, this is a BMW from the old school, and I really, really like it that way."
"A cracking little car."

And as he now got an F80 M3 as DD (see here), we all may look forward to his M2 6MT test drive review of early 2016.