[nlpamg]

I'm sorry if I didn't see it, but has there been any mention of the M2's steering in any of the discussions and/or press materials?

I just got back from the BMW Driving Experience (I only went for the coupon) where I autocrossed the M235i vert. (If BMW was trying to sell me a car with this event, they failed.)

The steering was atrocious, it totally makes me reconsider purchasing an M2 now. It was too light, numb and just imprecise. I had it in Sport and Sport+. Please tell me that the M2 will have better steering.

[metrickid]

It has a different, M developed, steering.

[hyperzulu]

It will have the ZF-made servotronic steering of the M3/4. If you don't like the steering on that car, then the M2 will not be any better for you. It will be better weighted than the M235i, but it won't be like the hydraulic steering of late model BMWs.

[IEDEI]

hopefully....the M235's steering is as you said 'atrocious'...a miserable uncommunicative mess...the M3's steering rack is probably much better but still electronic.

[nlpamg]

Well, I'm hoping.

This is a bigger deal breaker for me than the seats or mirrors.

[Twix]

Go drive an M4. It's the same part.

[Die ///M Rakete]

Originally Posted by nlpamg

I'm sorry if I didn't see it, but has there been any mention of the M2's steering in any of the discussions and/or press materials?

I just got back from the BMW Driving Experience (I only went for the coupon) where I autocrossed the M235i vert. (If BMW was trying to sell me a car with this event, they failed.)

The steering was atrocious, it totally makes me reconsider purchasing an M2 now. It was too light, numb and just imprecise. I had it in Sport and Sport+. Please tell me that the M2 will have better steering.

Oh please, the M235i's steering is far from "atrocious". As a matter of fact, it's pretty damn good.

Go drive a Ford Fusion to re-calibrate your idea of atrocious steering. Then go drive a 1970's Porsche 911 to define the opposite end of that spectrum.

The M2's steering is going to feel almost exactly as the current M3/M4, just as the 1M's steering feels almost exactly like the E90/92 M3's steering. In both cases they both share their M counterpart's steering racks.

Arrange a test drive before ordering because if you don't like how the steering feels on the F80/84 then the M2 is not going to be for you.

[-JLT-]

Originally Posted by nlpamg

Well, I'm hoping.

This is a bigger deal breaker for me than the seats or mirrors.

M2 steering will not be soft. In my M3, if u put the steering to Sport +, it's pretty stiff.

[nlpamg]

Originally Posted by -JLT-

M2 steering will not be soft. In my M3, if u put the steering to Sport +, it's pretty stiff.

sweet!

[nlpamg]

Originally Posted by Die ///M Rakete

Oh please, the M235i's steering is far from "atrocious". As a matter of fact, it's pretty damn good.

Go drive a Ford Fusion to re-calibrate your idea of atrocious steering. Then go drive a 1970's Porsche 911 to define the opposite end of that spectrum.

The M2's steering is going to feel almost exactly as the current M3/M4, just as the 1M's steering feels almost exactly like the E90/92 M3's steering. In both cases they both share their M counterpart's steering racks.

Arrange a test drive before ordering because if you don't like how the steering feels on the F80/84 then the M2 is not going to be for you.

To each his own. I'm not sure how anyone could say that the M235i's steering is quite good.

I'd rather not touch a Ford Fusion and I've driven a number of 1970's and other 911's to know what good steering feels like. Frankly, it's not an M235i. But then again, maybe I'm biased, I'm the person that asks for a Mini Cooper loaner if the dealership only has 328i loaners.

[Ramos]

As an owner of an M235 who came from an E36 M3 followed by an E46 M3, the steering is in fact lacking in feedback but it's actually pretty damn good once you get used to it. The accuracy is excellent in either mode.
Go drive a first year non sport (loaner) F30 328i and then talk about bad steering from BMW

The M235 is definitely one of the better electric racks out there, and the rack in the M2 borrowed from the F80x will be even better

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by nlpamg

To each his own. I'm not sure how anyone could say that the M235i's steering is quite good.

I'd rather not touch a Ford Fusion and I've driven a number of 1970's and other 911's to know what good steering feels like. Frankly, it's not an M235i. But then again, maybe I'm biased, I'm the person that asks for a Mini Cooper loaner if the dealership only has 328i loaners.

Perhaps you should better define your actual complaint or simply understand the reality of electric steering.

For example , If you don't like the 235 steering because it " doesn't feel the same as a hydraulic rack... Well then you simply would get a captain obvious award by saying the M2 electric steering doesn't feel mechanical.

Undoubtedly the M2 steering will be revised (Mproved) over the M235 and will likely be the M4/M3 system with perhaps a few slight tweaks.

If you simply have an " I hate electric steering " chip on your shoulder, then go drive a Cayman. It's typically indicated as one of the better racks on the planet and its electric. At the very least
You will have driven what most reviewers agree is the best there is.

You should probably drive an M4 now and save us the whining later ... Because if you really really dislike all electric steering then you should probably go find a 1M right away....

[nlpamg]

Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster

Perhaps you should better define your actual complaint or simply understand the reality of electric steering.

For example , If you don't like the 235 steering because it " doesn't feel the same as a hydraulic rack... Well then you simply would get a captain obvious award by saying the M2 electric steering doesn't feel mechanical.

Undoubtedly the M2 steering will be revised (Mproved) over the M235 and will likely be the M4/M3 system with perhaps a few slight tweaks.

If you simply have an " I hate electric steering " chip on your shoulder, then go drive a Cayman. It's typically indicated as one of the better racks on the planet and its electric. At the very least
You will have driven what most reviewers agree is the best there is.

You should probably drive an M4 now and save us the whining later ... Because if you really really dislike all electric steering then you should probably go find a 1M right away....

I articulated my complaint. The M235i's steering is too light and numb. Articulated. What do you want me to elaborate?

Did I ever say I hate electric steering? Go drive a Cayman? Lolol. I don't need to, nor do I need to listen to what some reviewers say. I have a 2015 Porsche GT3. It has electric steering. The feel isn't like a classic 911, but for electric steering, it's damn amazing. I'm not looking for that in something as cheap as an M2 which is being bought as my beater, but I'm looking for something that feels better than the numb M235i, because I'm not buying an M to go to parking lot meets.

[nlpamg]

Originally Posted by Ramos

As an owner of an M235 who came from an E36 M3 followed by an E46 M3, the steering is in fact lacking in feedback but it's actually pretty damn good once you get used to it. The accuracy is excellent in either mode.
Go drive a first year non sport (loaner) F30 328i and then talk about bad steering from BMW

The M235 is definitely one of the better electric racks out there, and the rack in the M2 borrowed from the F80x will be even better

Thanks for the feedback, perhaps I should have given it more of a shot. I'll drive the M3/4 and see what I think.

No thanks on the non-sport base 3-series loaners, lol.

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by nlpamg

I articulated my complaint. The M235i's steering is too light and numb. Articulated. What do you want me to elaborate?

Did I ever say I hate electric steering? Go drive a Cayman? Lolol. I don't need to, nor do I need to listen to what some reviewers say. I have a 2015 Porsche GT3. It has electric steering. The feel isn't like a classic 911, but for electric steering, it's damn amazing. I'm not looking for that in something as cheap as an M2 which is being bought as my beater, but I'm looking for something that feels better than the numb M235i, because I'm not buying an M to go to parking lot meets.

You never said you hated electric steering ( and oh so many people do ! ) but you also didn't give any other background, except for some talk about FWD MINIs, and of course it was a secret that you already have a Porsche with electric steering, so yes, you left half the story out. Lol. Go test drive an M4.

[nlpamg]

Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster

You never said you hated electric steering ( and oh so many people do ! ) but you also didn't give any other background, except for some talk about FWD MINIs, so yes you left half the story out. Lol. Guess we should read your mind.

Go test drive an M4.

Lol. Sorry.

Am I the only one that would rather drive a FWD Mini than a base 3-series?

I take all my cars to the track and have tracked at a lot of different tracks around the world and I also compete in the 24 Hours of Lemons and Chumpcar. I care more about performance, feel and fun than what most of the people here are whining about, like the mirrors and seats.

[Ramos]

Originally Posted by nlpamg

Lol. Sorry.

Am I the only one that would rather drive a FWD Mini than a base 3-series?

I take all my cars to the track and have tracked at a lot of different tracks around the world and I also compete in the 24 Hours of Lemons and Chumpcar. I care more about performance, feel and fun than what most of the people here are whining about, like the mirrors and seats.

Absolutely a mini is more fun and engaging than any 3 series..

The question to you is why an M2 if you already own what most of us can only dream of in the GT3?

If you're looking for a DD to complement your GT3 and offer some practicality (and assuming the extra $15k won't break the bank - no offense - if you can afford a GT3) then why not an M3?

[nlpamg]

Originally Posted by Ramos

Absolutely a mini is more fun and engaging than any 3 series..

The question to you is why an M2 if you already own what most of us can only dream of in the GT3?

If you're looking for a DD to complement your GT3 and offer some practicality (and assuming the extra $15k won't break the bank - no offense - if you can afford a GT3) then why not an M3?

You know, I struggled with that a bit as well.

I'm rather certain that it won't be that much cheaper than an M3. However, it's a mental thing for me. I don't want to feel like I'm paying that much for cars and it lets me feel better and rationalize about the GT3's replacement (I'm #1 at my dealer for the 991.2 GT3, but wouldn't mind getting a 650S or RWD Huracan). I also am very careful about parking my cars and detailing them, etc. The CLA45, for it's price point, I actually don't mind valeting it or parking it in places I normally wouldn't with my GT3 or GT-R or M5. I think I'd be paranoid again with an M3.

I intend to do the big group ED that Miguel (RSR) is planning and with it going to three tracks off the bat, I think this will be more engaging and fun.

I also like the size compared to the M3. I don't need a large car since it's usually just one or two people in the car including myself 90% of the time. I've also been waiting on the competition package for the M3 to come out and wouldn't consider buying an M3 without it. I'm not a fan of the M3's exhaust note either. If the competition comes out ready for that ED trip and it's amazing, I may sway. However, as of right now, I'm 95% team M2. Plus, it'll be the new car on the block for a little while. Driving the M235i today just scared me a bit that it would be numb and not fun to drive.

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by nlpamg

You know, I struggled with that a bit as well.

I'm rather certain that it won't be that much cheaper than an M3. However, it's a mental thing for me. I don't want to feel like I'm paying that much for cars and it lets me feel better and rationalize about the GT3's replacement (I'm #1 at my dealer for the 991.2 GT3, but wouldn't mind getting a 650S or RWD Huracan). I also am very careful about parking my cars and detailing them, etc. The CLA45, for it's price point, I actually don't mind valeting it or parking it in places I normally wouldn't with my GT3 or GT-R or M5. I think I'd be paranoid again with an M3.

I intend to do the big group ED that Miguel (RSR) is planning and with it going to three tracks off the bat, I think this will be more engaging and fun.

I also like the size compared to the M3. I don't need a large car since it's usually just one or two people in the car including myself 90% of the time. I've also been waiting on the competition package for the M3 to come out and wouldn't consider buying an M3 without it. I'm not a fan of the M3's exhaust note either. If the competition comes out ready for that ED trip and it's amazing, I may sway. However, as of right now, I'm 95% team M2. Plus, it'll be the new car on the block for a little while. Driving the M235i today just scared me a bit that it would be numb and not fun to drive.

Well the key thing to keep in mind is that just like a 135 is a big difference from a 1M... the same is true of M235 and the M2. In both situations you are talking about completely different suspension from the lower car.. even though it's the same chassis.

I've driven a 228 and while the steering is ok... it's actually reasonably accurate... it just that it's not that engaging. As fas as the M3/M4.. DO read some reviews... I have seen many reviewers that felt the M3/M4 steering was too artificial on Max settings... both Chris Harris and Jeremy Clarkson for example.. so you might find yourself disappointed if you just jump in a car and dial up one set of settings..

if you prefer a MINI.. over the current 3 series.. then yes... sounds like you would favor an M2 over an M4.... For most M2 owners This really isn't about value... (an M3/M4 is a better value)... but an M2 will be a simpler machine.. in a much smaller package..


I was really excited about the group event also and wanted to get an M2 but I am very much concerned over the published US curb weight... I also have a slight concern it won't come with manual seats... and items like electric steering (versus the mechanical rack in my 1M) as we'll as having to defeat auto rev match, have me looking at keeping my car at the moment.... Perhaps I can still make the trip by upgrading my daily driver.. SUV..

[david.orr]

I think we need to be clear about what we like or dislike about steering, what is good or bad about steering ........ steering feel/feedback OR steering precision?

[IEDEI]

Originally Posted by 1M235i

I think we need to be clear about what we like or dislike about steering, what is good or bad about steering ........ steering feel/feedback OR steering precision?

to me the M235's steering felt totally disconnected and more like an 'on/off' deal with artificial stiffness. It felt like a video game steering wheel. Pretty terrible....actually one of the worse electronic steering units I've felt recently as in them trying to make it 'sporty' they made it feel even worse!!!

The 981 Cayman's steering is OK....still kinda blah but way better than the M235's terrible lack of feel.

[gtaM2]

ive been wondering about this as well!

when i went for a test drive of the M235 the young kid took me to a parking lot and told me to drive in a circle a few times, for him to tell me this he must have thought id be impressed but i found the steering to be very soft and i couldnt even feel the road, my previous car the evo i just loved the feel of the steering

never driven an m3/m4 hopefully it is much sportier than the M235