[ClothSeats]

No blind spot monitoring or adjustable bolsters for 1LE. Like the M2, they are trying to keep price down by limiting configurations.



I'd expect the ZL1 to be $60k.. Z/28 now in development to go above that.

[M3R1]

One thing is for sure, whatever car you like, you can't really go wrong. The cars available now are really pretty awesome...

[RaceCarDriver]

Originally Posted by damnitBobby

satin-wrapped hood.. interesting

first for an automaker to provide a wrap from the factory.. or am i wrong?

the last generation 1LE had the wrap as well.

[Rock Sweden]

In this Motor Atrend video the Camaro SS handily beats the M4. In measurables it is dead even, but subjectively the SS takes it. On the road, they really rip on the M4. However, the M4 has a weird spec it seems like a stripper with CC brakes. I'm not sure anyone soecs them like that, but here's the video.

https://youtu.be/D87tO7VUs2I

[G8rGrl]

Originally Posted by Rock Sweden

In this Motor Atrend video the Camaro SS handily beats the M4. In measurables it is dead even, but subjectively the SS takes it. On the road, they really rip on the M4. However, the M4 has a weird spec it seems like a stripper with CC brakes. I'm not sure anyone soecs them like that, but here's the video.

There was a slight weight/time discrepancy due to the amount of fuel in each car at the time of testing:

"Confession time: Due to an oversight on our end, the BMW was lapped with only half a tank of premium. Our standard testing procedure is to test and lap all cars with full tanks. Assuming 7 gallons were missing, that?s about 40 pounds. We asked our SCCA Hall of Fame buddy what difference 40 pounds makes on a racetrack. ?Maybe a tenth,? Pobst said. Apologies to Camaro Nation, but our point about these two cars being near indistinguishable performers remains."

"I ran the numbers a couple of times just to make sure these were as close as the charts show,? road test editor Chris Walton noted when he emailed us the performance results. ?FREAKY close, nearly identical.? He ain?t kidding. It?s a virtual tie to 60 mph, the BMW needing 4.2 seconds and the Chevy taking 4.1 seconds. Same story in the quarter mile: Camaro in 12.4 seconds at 115.8 mph, M4 in 12.5 seconds at 116.5 mph. What about the figure eight? Both contenders came in at 24.1 seconds even though the Camaro?s average lateral acceleration is 1.01 g compared to 1.00 g for the M4. The wheelbases are identical: 110.7 inches each. We had Randy Pobst lap each around the Streets of Willow: 1:22.94 for the BMW, 1:23.15 for the Chevy."

http://www.motortrend.com/news/compa...let-camaro-ss/

[Mr Friese]

Originally Posted by G8rGrl

There was a slight weight/time discrepancy due to the amount of fuel in each car at the time of testing:

"Confession time: Due to an oversight on our end, the BMW was lapped with only half a tank of premium. Our standard testing procedure is to test and lap all cars with full tanks. Assuming 7 gallons were missing, that?s about 40 pounds. We asked our SCCA Hall of Fame buddy what difference 40 pounds makes on a racetrack. ?Maybe a tenth,? Pobst said. Apologies to Camaro Nation, but our point about these two cars being near indistinguishable performers remains."

"I ran the numbers a couple of times just to make sure these were as close as the charts show,? road test editor Chris Walton noted when he emailed us the performance results. ?FREAKY close, nearly identical.? He ain?t kidding. It?s a virtual tie to 60 mph, the BMW needing 4.2 seconds and the Chevy taking 4.1 seconds. Same story in the quarter mile: Camaro in 12.4 seconds at 115.8 mph, M4 in 12.5 seconds at 116.5 mph. What about the figure eight? Both contenders came in at 24.1 seconds even though the Camaro?s average lateral acceleration is 1.01 g compared to 1.00 g for the M4. The wheelbases are identical: 110.7 inches each. We had Randy Pobst lap each around the Streets of Willow: 1:22.94 for the BMW, 1:23.15 for the Chevy."

http://www.motortrend.com/news/compa...let-camaro-ss/

Tuned up "presser" Camaro against an M4 that was going to lose regardless of what the numbers were. Disgraceful journalism here and I'm no BMW fanboy.

[Vocans]

Originally Posted by ClothSeats

Motor Trend is clearly slanted towards GM. They already put the ATSV ahead of the M4, and the Camaro is basically the same platform with a Corvette motor. However, they also did a video on the M2 and loved it, and there's a new article bashing their long-term Corvette for rattles, so maybe these guys are just M4 haters?

Here's a review of a DCT M4 with the fixed suspension, cloth seats, and carbon ceramics again.

Much like the M2, Motor Trend loved the M3 and M4 in their first drive of the cars. It's only been in the comparison tests where they've not shown them any love:

"On the road, both sedan and coupe drive virtually identically. Both are extremely focused and an astonishing amount of fun to drive."

http://www.motortrend.com/news/2015-...m4-first-test/

[technik330]

Originally Posted by Adem1534

Umm... You're kidding about the ZL1 pricing, right? It's going to be at least 65-70k base.

That's GT350r pricing, not sure if this will be that high - it's possible though.

I'm curious to see how this will stack up against the GT350r, despite being quite a ways down on power.

[ClothSeats]

So pricing was announced today. $6500 package + $37900 for the base SS = $44,400. Can probably get a couple grand off since it isn't in demand.

My thoughts:

M2:
+ Smaller size is very nice for street driving
+ Better visibility
+ Euro delivery experience
+ Interior ergonomics
+ High resale
+ I like boost (subjective)
+ Looks better (subjective)

1LE:
+ Faster, and MRC gives flexibility in ride quality
+ You can turn on and off the rev matching whenever you want
+ Coolant and transmission temp gauges
+ N/A should fare better in hot climates than an air-to-air intercooled turbo engine
+ Recaros look good and appear to have deeper bolsters
+ I prefer suede over leather (subjective)
+ Sounds better (subjective)


Other things that don't affect me:
- Fewer paint options on M2. I only want black.
- No heated seats/wheel in Camaro. I have all the heat I need in Houston.
- Crooked seat in M2. Didn't notice it.
- No automatic or DCT for 1LE. Manual all the way.
- Both have crappy sound systems. Plan to get something aftermarket, maybe Focal or equivalent.

[bruin1md]

Originally Posted by ClothSeats

So pricing was announced today. $6500 package + $37900 for the base SS = $44,400. Can probably get a couple grand off since it isn't in demand.

My thoughts:

M2:
+ Smaller size is very nice for street driving
+ Better visibility
+ Euro delivery experience
+ Interior ergonomics
+ High resale
+ I like boost (subjective)
+ Looks better (subjective)

1LE:
+ Faster, and MRC gives flexibility in ride quality
+ You can turn on and off the rev matching whenever you want
+ Coolant and transmission temp gauges
+ N/A should fare better in hot climates than an air-to-air intercooled turbo engine
+ Recaros look good and appear to have deeper bolsters
+ I prefer suede over leather (subjective)
+ Sounds better (subjective)


Other things that don't affect me:
- Fewer paint options on M2. I only want black.
- No heated seats/wheel in Camaro. I have all the heat I need in Houston.
- Crooked seat in M2. Didn't notice it.
- No automatic or DCT for 1LE. Manual all the way.
- Both have crappy sound systems. Plan to get something aftermarket, maybe Focal or equivalent.

Sounds like we're in similar boats.

I'm a few hours away from you in Lafayette, and if I keep my order in place, should be allocated my M2 for Sept, with Oct build and Nov delivery (fingers crossed).

But I've seriously been considering going full on Kenny Powers and getting the Camaro SS, or even a Shelby GT350 (if I can get one under MSRP and not the ridiculous mark ups many dealers are charging).
I've always been a German car whore, but for the first time ever, am now tempted by American muscle because of the massive improvements in performance over the last 5-6 years made by Chevy and Ford. They aren't just pony cars anymore and represent a great value.
The camaro SS in particular -- motor trend car of the year-- and priced out at around $47K fully optioned out, which means one can probably negotiate at least a few thousand off that.

Not a bad value at all.

BUT.......I don't want to turn down the chance to get M2 in a few months when others have been waiting forever for a car that has near universal love.

[scoale]

Originally Posted by DS_BMW

I have to say I agree!!

And a 3rd

[ClothSeats]

Originally Posted by bruin1md

Sounds like we're in similar boats.

I'm a few hours away from you in Lafayette, and if I keep my order in place, should be allocated my M2 for Sept, with Oct build and Nov delivery (fingers crossed).

But I've seriously been considering going full on Kenny Powers and getting the Camaro SS, or even a Shelby GT350 (if I can get one under MSRP and not the ridiculous mark ups many dealers are charging).
I've always been a German car whore, but for the first time ever, am now tempted by American muscle because of the massive improvements in performance over the last 5-6 years made by Chevy and Ford. They aren't just pony cars anymore and represent a great value.
The camaro SS in particular -- motor trend car of the year-- and priced out at around $47K fully optioned out, which means one can probably negotiate at least a few thousand off that.

Not a bad value at all.

BUT.......I don't want to turn down the chance to get M2 in a few months when others have been waiting forever for a car that has near universal love.

I've liked American muscle in the past but never really looked at them as a German alternative until now. The current Shelby and Camaro SS are cars I would buy on their own merits and not just because they are the cheaper option.

If I were you I would take delivery of the M2 and sell it if I didn't like it. Won't take much of a loss if any. But I have to wait 1-2 years for my allocation which is why I'm looking at other options. Might just get both a 1LE and an E36 M3..

[Msmall143]

ive owned a 1LE and a ZL1, both within the last 18 months. personally, they felt cheap. you can show whatever specs, stats, times etc you would like. but at the end of the day, when you are looking for enjoyment driving the streets, the bmw feels much better.

[ClothSeats]

Originally Posted by Msmall143

ive owned a 1LE and a ZL1, both within the last 18 months. personally, they felt cheap. you can show whatever specs, stats, times etc you would like. but at the end of the day, when you are looking for enjoyment driving the streets, the bmw feels much better.

I agree.. for the old model. The 6th gen is much more comfortable.

[bruin1md]

Originally Posted by Msmall143

ive owned a 1LE and a ZL1, both within the last 18 months. personally, they felt cheap. you can show whatever specs, stats, times etc you would like. but at the end of the day, when you are looking for enjoyment driving the streets, the bmw feels much better.

As cloth seats said, the 6th gen Camaro is a much improved car-- both in terms of performance and refinement. I've sat in one and it didn't feel cheap at all

[bruin1md]

Originally Posted by ClothSeats

I've liked American muscle in the past but never really looked at them as a German alternative until now. The current Shelby and Camaro SS are cars I would buy on their own merits and not just because they are the cheaper option.

If I were you I would take delivery of the M2 and sell it if I didn't like it. Won't take much of a loss if any. But I have to wait 1-2 years for my allocation which is why I'm looking at other options. Might just get both a 1LE and an E36 M3..

I think that's sound advice and what I'm leaning towards doing. If i'm not happy with it, I can sell it in 6 months with no real loss.

I went on auto trader -- there are 591 Shelby GT 350's for sale brand new.
Meanwhile, there are only 9-- that's right, 9-- M2's for sale nationwide.

So yes, if they can assure me the car will be ready for November, that's the route I'm going.
And if I love it, great-- I'm set. And if not, I'll make the switch.

[W///]

Really impressive lap time considering cost at C&D VIR

[ClothSeats]

Got an email this morning from my BMW dealer. $5k markup on M2, $10k markup on CS/CSL. (They said no markup when I originally joined)

I was really hyped about the CS and do prefer the ease of use around town in the 2, but I don't know if I'd want to pay $80k for one.

So I drove this today and the dealer offered $4000 off. I took it.

[CosmosMpower]

Originally Posted by ClothSeats

Got an email this morning from my BMW dealer. $5k markup on M2, $10k markup on CS/CSL. (They said no markup when I originally joined)

I was really hyped about the CS and do prefer the ease of use around town in the 2, but I don't know if I'd want to pay $80k for one.

So I drove this today and the dealer offered $4000 off. I took it.

My condolences

[ClothSeats]

Originally Posted by CosmosMpower

My condolences

[StraightUpFitness]

Originally Posted by ClothSeats

Got an email this morning from my BMW dealer. $5k markup on M2, $10k markup on CS/CSL. (They said no markup when I originally joined)

I was really hyped about the CS and do prefer the ease of use around town in the 2, but I don't know if I'd want to pay $80k for one.

So I drove this today and the dealer offered $4000 off. I took it.

Congrats! That is a 1LE right (hard to see if that hood is matte(

I actually had a GT350R for 2 months and sold it because I got a ridiculous offer and made money on it.

But now my e36 M3 is my daily driver and I miss having a muscle car. The GT350R was great, but the CF wheels at $4,000 each gave me anxiety driving around potholes.

How do you like the 1LE so far? Any plans on tracking it?

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by ClothSeats

Got an email this morning from my BMW dealer. $5k markup on M2, $10k markup on CS/CSL. (They said no markup when I originally joined)

I was really hyped about the CS and do prefer the ease of use around town in the 2, but I don't know if I'd want to pay $80k for one.

So I drove this today and the dealer offered $4000 off. I took it.

Another M2 buyer bites the dust ! Sorry your BMW Dealer sucks. Hopefully you weren't waiting for a local dealer anyway ..