[quikM2]

Originally Posted by arwin

Well, when I think about it...instead of getting the DCT, I put that money towards the MPE and part of my sunroof

exactly what I did... except if the DCT was $500 I still would have chosen the manual but for $4k I think it's a no brainer

[ZPrime]

Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster

it's certainly possible to install remote start technology on a MT car.
The owner simply should take care not to ever leave the transmission in gear and leave the parking brake on. This has been the case since the advent of remote start technology..

Well, there's a lot to be said about "comes with the car" remote start vs. aftermarket. I had an aftermarket remote start system on the first car I bought myself - 2004 Toyota Matrix XRS, 6-speed. The shop that installed it did some trick work with a Hall-effect sensor so the car wouldn't start if it was left in gear, and wouldn't start unless the handbrake was pulled. If you remote started it, and then tried to put it in gear before putting in and turning the key, it would also shut off then.

But that car didn't have anywhere near the tech that a modern BMW does. The remote start also added remote window control / venting from the aftermarket fob (I just stopped using the factory fob and used the aftermarket one instead). Things have changed a lot with the integrated systems though, I know you can code in remote-windows if they aren't enabled by default (have to be coded on a US-spec VW/Audi for example). I'd much rather have an integrated system than aftermarket, and if integrated remote start was offered on DCT but not on 6MT, that would potentially sway me to DCT.

I agree with most others though, for the price they are asking for DCT, I can't justify it, and I'm someone who actually likes dual-clutch transmissions and isn't "married" to a 6mt. My financial situation recently changed (big raise I've deserved for a long time) and now the cost of the DCT isn't as much of a concern... but I still think I'll be going with a 6MT.

[3Si]

Originally Posted by arwin

Well, when I think about it...instead of getting the DCT, I put that money towards the MPE and part of my sunroof

But non of those will make your M2 faster.

While it is a little more expensive than DSG or PDK, it's not that far off. There are not a lot of mods that will guarantee the type of performance gain a DCT can. If you don't care about performance, then sure.

[DoggieHowser]

Originally Posted by 3Si

But non of those will make your M2 faster.

While it is a little more expensive than DSG or PDK, it's not that far off. There are not a lot of mods that will guarantee the type of performance gain a DCT can. If you don't care about performance, then sure.

If it was all about going fastest, we would be in the latest Audi TTRS wouldn't we?

[3Si]

Originally Posted by DoggieHowser

If it was all about going fastest, we would be in the latest Audi TTRS wouldn't we?

ZL1

[XutvJet]

Originally Posted by Isty

I have driven dct twice and I didnt feel any lag with the m2, yesterday I drove a manual for the first time (have manual on order) and it felt reaaally laggy compared to the dct.
Also the power delivery didnt feel as linnear with the manual.

I have to put some more drivinghours before I can't change my order anymore

The DCT is geared deeper and there's no real boost loss on shifts because there's no loss in engine load thus the turbo stays spooled. The 6MT feels way more turbocharged than the BMW turbo auto/DCT variants. For some of us, we prefer that because it offers character. I also like the option to be able to shift lazy and slow or hard and in anger. With a DCT, the shift is nearly instantaneous no matter what. If you're out to chase numbers then the DCT is the only option.

Throttle response in the 6MT can be remedied easily with a Sprint Booster throttle controller. I have one installed on my M235 6MT. There are 18 different throttle settings I can change between. I love it because I wanted a throttle response in between Sport and Comfort. Now I have it.

[JustChris]

Originally Posted by DoggieHowser

If it was all about going fastest, we would be in the latest Audi TTRS wouldn't we?

That thing is really insane. Measures at 3.4s 0-60 wtf for the money!

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by Isty

I have driven dct twice and I didnt feel any lag with the m2, yesterday I drove a manual for the first time (have manual on order) and it felt reaaally laggy compared to the dct.
Also the power delivery didnt feel as linnear with the manual.

I have to put some more drivinghours before I can't change my order anymore

See the comments from aerobat earlier.

If one is focused on 0-60 times, street starts , street racing , or Drag racing then a DCT is definitely what you want.

The only time I ever drive 0-60 is getting onto a highway and leaving the paddock going onto the track. I don't street race and I don't hoon around much at all on the street because I regularly Autocross and HPDE.

Even a launch at an Autocross course you don't get to 60 because generally by the time you get out of first gear and well into second there is an element.. ...

I absolutely love MT for the connection to the car.

Manufacturers are removing these connections one by one. First was the accelerator ( drive by wire throttle ) then the steering wheel (EPS), the shifter continues to be under siege since the advent of automatic transmissions, and even the clutch in a manual vehicle is under siege from auto -rev match.

The only actually direct connection to many modern vehicles is through the power assisted brake pedal and a heated and cooled, power operated seat.

If you actually enjoy driving ... as opposed to your vehicle being more of a point to point machine that carries you around ..then actually being able to make physical contact with the machine certainly seems mandatory ...

[3Si]

Originally Posted by XutvJet

I also like the option to be able to shift lazy and slow or hard and in anger. With a DCT, the shift is nearly instantaneous no matter what.

The difference between comfort and sport+ mode is ridiculously huge.

[aerobat]

Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster

See the comments from aerobat earlier.

If one is focused on 0-60 times, street starts , street racing , or Drag racing then a DCT is definitely what you want.

The only time I ever drive 0-60 is leaving the paddock going onto the track. I don't street race and I don't hook around much at all on the street because I regularly Autocross and HPDE.

Even a launch at an Autocross course you don't get to 60 because generally by the time you get out of first gear and well into second there is an element.. :

I assume you never have driven on free speed German Autobahn?
This weekend I did almost 1000km there. Lot of time between 170-250kph.
DCT is just outstanding here. It is realy easy to drive focused, both hands on wheel, which actually is preferred when there is some traffic and when straights becomes turns in this speed.
Manual is just not as good.

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by aerobat

I assume you never have driven on free speed German Autobahn?
This weekend I did almost 1000km there. Lot of time between 170-250kph.
DCT is just outstanding here. It is realy easy to drive focused, both hands on wheel, which actually is preferred when there is some traffic and when straights becomes turns in this speed.
Manual is just not as good.

I have driven on the autobahn. And I have also gone up and down the stelvio pass in my 1M.

Loved every bit of it driving a manual transmission and with manual steering as well

DCT is not " better " (that's an opinion) it's faster !

[aerobat]

Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster

I have driven on the autobahn. And I have also gone up and down the stelvio pass in my 1M.

Loved every bit of it driving a manual transmission and with manual steering as well

DCT is not " better " (that's an opinion) it's faster !

I dont understand what Stelvio Pass have to do with anything?! I have gone up and down Stelvio several times in different cars, but that is something else.

"Better" is of course my humble subjective opinion. But I do find i difficult to understand the point or fun of taking hands of wheel at these speeds.
Also the 7th gear makes it "Better".

[DoggieHowser]

Here's Top Gear's take. I know it's not gospel but...



https://www.topgear.com/car-reviews/m2/first-drive-0

"So gearbox: manual or M DCT?

Well, I?ve driven both and the manual suits the car better. This is not a tech-laden, speed-focused machine, but one that wants to have a good time. The manual matches that character.

However, the shift isn?t that great. The lever/throw combination is a bit long, the clutch travels too far and the shift quality isn?t snappy enough ? the transmission occasionally baulks if you try to hurry it through too fast. It?s slightly tricky to drive smoothly in traffic. Oh, and I like to heel and toe myself and in the BMW you can?t stop it rev-blipping for you in any mode. You might like that, of course.

But I?d still have it because, unlike the M3, the M2 feels like it was born to have a stick between the seats.....

Anyway, enough of that for the time being, I?m just glad to be able to report that the M2 is corking good fun to drive. If you?re tempted, there aren?t many options you absolutely have to add because it?s well equipped as standard (are you listening Porsche?), but do me a favour and think twice before spending an extra £2,645 on the double clutch gearbox."

[akkando]

Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster

The only actually direct connection to many modern vehicles is through the power assisted brake pedal and a heated and cooled, power operated seat.

I think you should buy a bicycle It has great direct connection for pilot to vehicle lol.

[M2Nebula]

Are you saying that the DCT goes to 11? :-] Love that pass btw, Susten pass is my favorite though. If you are on a mission then no doubt, DCT....but if you want to mix it up a bit and add a casual flare and relax in between sessions, 6MT all the way. It evens out the overall experience. We will never agree on which is better, the passion for driving is why you bought the car in the first place. Enjoy what ever you got and don't look back....

[DoggieHowser]

More fodder from Top Gear - in their Best B Road car - the M2 in 6MT of course

https://www.topgear.com/car-news/why...road-blaster#8

"And it?s a manual. On a couple of occasions I catch myself finger-tapping the back of the wheel, but then I remember I get to do something better. The shift has the same beefy positivity as the rest of the car. It?ll rev blip for you unless you disable the traction completely, and personally I enjoy the punctuation mark that clutching and shifting interjects between each lunge of acceleration. It makes you think more, actively involves you. "

[BlacMacJac]

I was convinced I was going to order the MT, until I actually drove the DCT - and I kinda liked it... although it I do wonder how long it would be before I yearned for the use of all my appendages.

[ZPrime]

Originally Posted by BlacMacJac

I was convinced I was going to order the MT, until I actually drove the DCT - and I kinda liked it... although it I do wonder how long it would be before I yearned for the use of all my appendages.

Speaking from experience, for the first week your left leg is going to keep trying to push a clutch that isn't there. Then you kinda forget about it, and you'll feel like a race driver with the paddles. The uninterrupted power flow and lighting shifts are a blast.

After about 6-12 months though, you'll get a bit bored and miss having something for the right hand to do.

After a year you'll remember that you can left-foot-brake... one of the problems with the DCT is that it has a 6MT-sized brake pedal which makes this a lot more difficult due to where they hang it. On the R32, the wide brake pedal makes it easier. I had a lot of fun in that car with LFB and the paddles at track days, makes it so much easier to late-brake and snap down several gears to get the car to rotate. (R32s are nose-heavy FWD-ish pigs)

You'll always miss it though, and there will be times you long for it. I lived with a dual clutch for 7 years before going back to a 6MT car... and surprisingly I'm kind of regretting it. I think a lot of my regret stems from the vague clutch and sloppy gearbox/shifter though.

That's what's making the decision on the M2 so hard for me. I'm upset with my current 6MT, and it's hard to get enough seat time in a BMW 6MT to fully make up my mind. DCT cars are much more common, M3/M4 sit around all over the place that most dealers will let you take around the block a few times...

[Robin_NL]

Originally Posted by aerobat

I assume you never have driven on free speed German Autobahn?
This weekend I did almost 1000km there. Lot of time between 170-250kph.
DCT is just outstanding here. It is realy easy to drive focused, both hands on wheel, which actually is preferred when there is some traffic and when straights becomes turns in this speed.
Manual is just not as good.

This. I drove from Netherlands to Switzerland this january via the Autobahn. DCT is a great thing. And you have one more gear. Speeds are a tiny bit higher compared to USA
240kmh max(150mph) because Pilot Alpins...not allowed >240kmh....

Cheers
Robin

[eau_rouge]

DCT just bores me. Especially when driving fast on twisty roads. Its too easy - too modern. It does not make me happy the same way a manual does. It's like working for something to finally get it (achieve it), rather than growing up rich where everything is possible. The feeling is just different if you work for something. I will always buy a MT transmission in a sports car as long as it is available.

[aerobat]

Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster

I have driven on the autobahn. And I have also gone up and down the stelvio pass in my 1M.

Loved every bit of it driving a manual transmission and with manual steering as well

DCT is not " better " (that's an opinion) it's faster !

Almost everything here is about opinions - great about forums
DCT is better if I think it is better (to me).

[_bmwdriver_]

Rock beats scissors; Scissors beat paper and

3 pedals beat for 2 stupid paddles every time!

It's the difference between loving to drive vs. getting to point A from point B.