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      07-29-2017, 01:52 PM   #1
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Will the M2 Ever Get the "S" Engine in Future Gens?

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Just a thinking out loud type of discussion, so since technically the M2 in a way replaced the 1M, it seems to me BMW might stick with this formula and never give the M2 the "S" engine. Instead, always give it a tuned version of their current straight 6 turbo or future platforms.

I know the M2 CS version will get the S55, but that is a limited edition. As for the next gen base M2, I'm guessing it will get a tuned version of the B58 thats currently in the M240i. I'm sure it will still be a great engine with lots of power, but it won't have the goodies of what a possible S58 that the M3/M4 will get.

Thoughts?

Last edited by Motivate; 07-29-2017 at 07:11 PM..
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      07-29-2017, 02:05 PM   #2
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Don't think so. We collectively have proven we don't care and have thrown our money at BMW despite the antiquated N55 in there. BMW M has admitted they are so concerned at the M2 nipping at the heels of the $20K more expensive M3 that they won't even put M mirrors on it in an attempt to further differentiate the 2. I agree that the next M2 (e.g., 2020ish) will get a B58+ rather than an S58.
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      07-29-2017, 04:10 PM   #3
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If an M2 gets a b58 version it will probably support more aggressive tuning than the N55 at least, so there's that.
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      07-29-2017, 04:31 PM   #4
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I seriously doubt the next M2 will still have a 6 cylinders engine.

So it won’t matter anymore.
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      07-29-2017, 05:10 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motivate View Post
Just a thinking out loud type of discussion, so since technically the M2 in a way replaced the 1M, it seems to me BMW might stick with this formula and never give the M2 the "S" engine. Instead, always give it a tuned version of their current V6 turbo or future platforms.

I know the M2 CS version will get the S55, but that is a limited edition. As for the next gen base M2, I'm guessing it will get a tuned version of the B58 thats currently in the M240i. I'm sure it will still be a great engine with lots of power, but it won't have the goodies of what a possible S58 that the M3/M4 will get.

Thoughts?
Im pretty positive BMW will never plant a V6 turbo in any of their vehicles.
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      07-29-2017, 05:50 PM   #6
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My guess is it would only get an S engine in the base M2 model if it's a 4 cylinder S engine.
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      07-29-2017, 06:37 PM   #7
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There is no line BMW won't cross these days. They do whatever as they see profitable.
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      07-29-2017, 07:13 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akkando View Post
If an M2 gets a b58 version it will probably support more aggressive tuning than the N55 at least, so there's that.

Yes, more than likely it will get a tuned version of the B58 pushing about 400hp 400 lb ft.
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      07-29-2017, 07:24 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stefan View Post
Don't think so. We collectively have proven we don't care and have thrown our money at BMW despite the antiquated N55 in there. BMW M has admitted they are so concerned at the M2 nipping at the heels of the $20K more expensive M3 that they won't even put M mirrors on it in an attempt to further differentiate the 2. I agree that the next M2 (e.g., 2020ish) will get a B58+ rather than an S58.

I am new to the forum. Is this true? Can I have the source? I want to read into this!
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      07-29-2017, 08:48 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chrislocho View Post
I am new to the forum. Is this true? Can I have the source? I want to read into this!
In a way it just makes sense. If they had put a slightly de-tuned version of the S55 in the current M2, who would still buy the M4? I think the M2 will always be more of an enthusiasts' M car while the M3/M4 are now geared more towards the executive who wants a daily car that is extremely fast without sacrificing the luxurious interior, long list of options, interior space etc.
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      07-30-2017, 04:29 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Motivate View Post
I know the M2 CS version will get the S55, but that is a limited edition.
No preset production number for the M2 CS (no "× of ×××" cap).

So no, technically no "limited production" or "limited edition".

Only real restrictions: factory production schedule (the Leipzig factory manufactures lots of models) and the end of production date (2020 cut-off date for the first generation M2). Those could result into "limited availability" (availability in low quantities).
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      07-30-2017, 05:30 AM   #12
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It's been discussed a lot, the question of how BMW must differentiate, keep a distance, between the M2 and the M4. I'm more wondering how BMW will differentiate the NEXT gen M4 and the new M5? Both 4wd large GT type cars. My point being, depending on how the next gen M3 will be positioned one can speculate what the next M2 will be.

Last edited by MagnusT; 07-30-2017 at 06:48 AM..
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      07-30-2017, 06:12 AM   #13
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Pretty convinced that this is the last generation models with a 6 cylinders !!!!!!
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      07-30-2017, 06:50 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glounk View Post
Pretty convinced that this is the last generation models with a 6 cylinders !!!!!!
Why would you think that? B58 will for sure be in the 2er.

BMW would be mad to cut the balls off its best drivers car for the masses.
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      07-30-2017, 07:04 AM   #15
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My guess is a power oriented hybrid :-D
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      07-30-2017, 07:25 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glounk View Post
Pretty convinced that this is the last generation models with a 6 cylinders !!!!!!
At some point during F87 M2 development a 4-cyl has been considered.

But as we know, the 6-cyl made it to the final cut of the first generation M2.

Thank you, BMW.
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      07-30-2017, 07:35 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artemis View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Glounk View Post
Pretty convinced that this is the last generation models with a 6 cylinders !!!!!!
At some point during F87 M2 development a 4-cyl has been considered.

But as we know, the 6-cyl made it to the final cut of the first generation M2.

Thank you, BMW.
At no point could a 4 cylinder be considered for F87 m2. There is no 2.0L powerplant to date from BMW that supports 365 crank HP. The engine debates can only be between a beefed up n55/b58 or a detuned s55. So think twice thanking BMW for the decision.

And if you consider F22 m235 already has a 6-pot N55, a 4-cylinder for F87 would easily have been the all-time stupidest M decision.
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      07-30-2017, 07:37 AM   #18
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I think 4 cylinder is possible too if they truly try to go back to the lightweight performer concept. I’m thinking more like 2.0 turbo in a Z4M/BRZ/FRS-like platform but with about the same amount of power as the current M2. Kinda more like Lotus Elise performance and would rival something like my Stingray on shorter tracks since it would probably suffer more on the top end than it already does.

I agree getting rid of the legendarily smooth i6 would be a problem, at least for me. Inline sixes are probably one of the best designed engines you can have and what drew me to BMW. Very smooth, way less vibrations, which in turn help them last a lot longer if the engine is designed properly to begin with.
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      07-30-2017, 07:40 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanWRT View Post
At no point could a 4 cylinder be considered for F87 m2. There is no 2.0L powerplant to date from BMW that supports 365 crank HP.

And if you consider m235 already has a 6-pot N55, a 4-cylinder for F87 would easily have been the all-time stupidest M decision.
Actually, VAG already has a 2.5l with 350hp in the Cayman S and there are tunes taking it into the 400hp range. Most VW/Audi 2.0T motors can be tuned to 360hp on simple stage 1tune, meaning no other mods required. So we’re already there, it’s just a matter of BMW putting it together. And if the car weighs something like 2500-2800lbs, so having 365hp becomes less critical.

Last edited by c1pher; 07-30-2017 at 07:53 AM..
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      07-30-2017, 07:48 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MGM135is View Post
Actually, VAG already has a 2.5l with 350hp in the Cayman S and there are tunes taking it into the 400hp range. Most VW/Audi 2.0T motors can be tuned to 360hp on simple stage 1tune, meaning no other mods required. So we’re already there, it’s just a matter of BMW putting it together.
Agree. And for example, stock:

Audi RS3 - 400hp
Mercedes AMG CLA45 - 375hp
Ford Focus RS - 350hp

But BMW has yet to make a 4 pot with that power? But it's surely coming... They are at 325hp stock today I think in the B58 540?
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      07-30-2017, 07:58 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnusT View Post
Agree. And for example, stock:

Audi RS3 - 400hp
Mercedes AMG CLA45 - 375hp
Ford Focus RS - 350hp

But BMW has yet to make a 4 pot with that power? But it's surely coming... They are at 325hp stock today I think in the B58 540?
Well, the N55 had 300hp at it’s debut. It’s now up to 365 and probably could go up to 400 without much trouble. So I’m sure BMW is applying the same strategy to its 4 cylinder lineup.

I actually like the iM2 concept.
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      07-30-2017, 07:59 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MGM135is View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanWRT View Post
At no point could a 4 cylinder be considered for F87 m2. There is no 2.0L powerplant to date from BMW that supports 365 crank HP.

And if you consider m235 already has a 6-pot N55, a 4-cylinder for F87 would easily have been the all-time stupidest M decision.
Actually, VAG already has a 2.5l with 350hp in the Cayman S and there are tunes taking it into the 400hp range. Most VW/Audi 2.0T motors can be tuned to 360hp on simple stage 1tune, meaning no other mods required. So we’re already there, it’s just a matter of BMW putting it together. And if the car weighs something like 2500-2800lbs, so having 365hp becomes less critical.
I got that. But could a 365hp 4-pot happen at any point during F87 development? I see no possibility until next gen M of 1/2er.

BMW wouldn't even bother with new techs on F87, they tried hard to put together as many existing stuffs as possible to avoid R&D cost of a comparatively low volume production car. If anything else they had in mind with M2, it should be how to properly position it so M3/4 in sales don't get hurt.
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