[W///]

Originally Posted by Hazey82

Ok so I'm going to assume that a big part of why you bought your e92 is the engine. The intoxicating sound winding it out to 8400rpm. Same goes with my e46 it's just a piece but a MAJOR one Both these cars need to be taken by the scruff of the neck and driven in the high rev band to come alive. That feeling has been lost with the F8x. Nothing exciting happens beyond 6000rpm, there is no gain above it, it's all about short shifting and utilising that massive torque. Anyone who thinks otherwise is living in denial. Sure it's a great engine but it lacks soul. I want to wind an M car out not short shift at 5k each gear. Plenty of other cars to do that.

The reason I am looking at the M2 is for a modern interpretation of my E46 and it's been stated in many m235i reviews and even 1M that the engine sounds great and encourages taking it to redline. All the F8x comments regarding the engine are the opposite. I've driven one and I agree but would like some more seat time.
So I hope that they can improve on the positives of the N55 and make it exciting. If they want to make the M2 just about wide fenders, better brakes, newer tech diff then I'll happily stick with my E46, look at e92/1M or look at Porsche because if I am going to spend the big $$$ on my first brand new M,I want it to be SPECIAL and unique in its model series.

BMW has made the choice to go turbo while others like porsche, AMG, audi etc can manage to stay NA. If that's the choice they have made then they should spend the time making it sound decent. I still don't get why they couldn't have stayed small block v8 with turbochargers. Anyway I'm going way off topic now.
BMW sort your sh*t out please so I don't have to restrict myself to a 2 seater cayman GTS that is a pure drivers car not lacking any character or soul.

You're all over the place now. You started off by saying because the M2 didn't get M3/4 seats, that you are out. You are more than entitled to your opinion, but I just think that's such a ridiculous reason to skip a car considering seats come off by taking out 4 bolts.

The really ironic thing you said in your post is that BMW made the choice to go turbo while the others didn't. Newsflash: Audi and MB are also turbo, and Porsche is literally on the verge of going turbo as well, unless you are talking about GT cars. But then we are talking about a completely different price bracket than the M2. Another ironic thing is that the GT4, probably one of the most hyped car in the past 10 years, is also a parts car (suspension from GT3, engine from C2S ect ect)

When you are talking about taking the engines to redline, are you talking about noise or response? I've literally never heard anyone say that the N54 and N55 pull harder to redline than the S55. If we are talking about noise, then I agree, it's not the best. But I also happen to think the E46 M3 sounds pretty poor from factory too. I fully expect the aftermarket community to come up with something better eventually(just like they did for the E46). At the end of the day, I don't think the S55 sounds bad enough that I wouldn't consider it. What I really don't like is the coldstart sequence, it sounds awful.

While I absolutely love the Cayman, the GTS just isn't the car for me. For one, it's way out of my budget. Secondly, I want to experiment with turbos because I've already got 2 NA cars that I plan on keeping.

I still can't figure out what you are looking for your next car. You say that you would consider the 1M, but then say that the M2 has no soul? And while I love my E92, it's not even remotely close to the driver's car the Cayman is. But if you are set on something high revving, then this is definitely not the forum to be on.

P.S. I should also mention that I'd never give up my E92 M3 for an M2 for what it's worth.

[W///]

Originally Posted by Glassjaw047

Not trying to say you're wrong or anything but the way I see things is just because it's being called "Pyrat 2" doesn't mean they have to implement the same boring stitching like they did in the 1M ("Pyrat"). With the next generation (being the 2 Series), you would think there would be an improvement off the 1 Series/1M which there most definitely has been already but with the M2 coming you would just think that we'd see an interior besides blue stitching that would distinguish itself apart from the rest of the line. Just what I would think and I'm sure many others. But in the end I'm not going to be pissed off about seats or anything of that nature because once revealed, I know it's going to be one heck of a machine

Understand where I'm coming from on that?

Completely understand where you are coming from. But I just don't let minor things like that sway me from a car, I'm just saying. Things like seats, wheels and exhausts are changeable.

Things like wheelbase, track width and just general size, which the M2 has over the M4 (for what I'm looking for) is not. In the grand scheme of things, those minor interior details are not going to sway me from a great driving car, assuming the price is right. Also, the brakes, the stiffness, the power... THOSE are improvements over the 1M that I care about.

[Glassjaw047]

Originally Posted by W///

Completely understand where you are coming from. But I just don't let minor things like that sway me from a car, I'm just saying. Things like seats, wheels and exhausts are changeable.

Things like wheelbase, track width and just general size, which the M2 has over the M4 (for what I'm looking for) is not. In the grand scheme of things, those minor interior details are not going to sway me from a great driving car, assuming the price is right.

Well said my friend and very true! Because again, this is about being a "drivers car" and not 100% solely based on the cars' interior looks.

I hope they at least put an ///M Logo in the seat at least just to differentiate itself from the M235i...

[W///]

Originally Posted by Glassjaw047

Well said my friend and very true! Because again, this is about being a "drivers car" and not 100% solely based on the cars' interior looks.

I hope they at least put an ///M Logo in the seat at least just to differentiate itself from the M235i...

Exactly. I'm not saying the interior is not important, I'm just saying that it's farrrrrr from the most important. But from reading this thread, you'd think it was

I'm just using the 1M and M235i as a gauge of how good this M2 should be. My absolute biggest thing is BMW's best effort at being a driver's car, while being priced correctly. Those are huge concerns to me.

[UpNcOmINg!]

I am honestly not too bothered with what seems like some corner cutting by BMW here.
I see they have brought some nice things over such as the iDrive by the looks of things, the DCT tranny as well, but I just hope that this corner cutting makes its way to the consumer/client/future owner as a cost cut on the total package.

[Glassjaw047]

Originally Posted by W///

Exactly. I'm not saying the interior is not important, I'm just saying that it's farrrrrr from the most important. But from reading this thread, you'd think it was

I'm just using the 1M and M235i as a gauge of how good this M2 should be. My absolute biggest thing is BMW's best effort at being a driver's car, while being priced correctly. Those are huge concerns to me.

Correct Again.

I just don't see how this car cannot be priced between $49K-$52K at most considering that if you look at the M235i it has M goodies to begin with at a $43,100 price point. It's not suppose to be a new engine just tuned, quad exhaust, bigger wheels, wide body, the calipers look the same(correct me if I am wrong) but drilled rotors added, DCT, LSD? and blue stitching in the seats. With the 435i ($46,250) and M4 ($64,200), a $17,950 starting price difference but with way more M Goodies/Performance Parts and a totally different engine. Your thoughts again on this?

[Advevo]

Standard m235i seats with Blue stichting is fine. I change them for recaro race seats like the GTS anyway!

[W///]

Originally Posted by Glassjaw047

Correct Again.

I just don't see how this car cannot be priced between $49K-$52K at most considering that if you look at the M235i it has M goodies to begin with at a $43,100 price point. It's not suppose to be a new engine just tuned, quad exhaust, bigger wheels, wide body, the calipers look the same(correct me if I am wrong) but drilled rotors added, DCT, LSD? and blue stitching in the seats. With the 435i ($46,250) and M4 ($64,200), a $17,950 starting price difference but with way more M Goodies/Performance Parts and a totally different engine. Your thoughts again on this?

I don't see the M2 starting at 49k personally. I predict 51-53k. I hope to be wrong and it comes under that though! But you are right, the gap won't be as big. Because we are comparing an M235i and M2 vs a regular 435i and M4.

As for the M2, it's not just an N55 with a tune, but rather N55 with S55 components. Unknown which components at this point.

[Glassjaw047]

Originally Posted by W///

I don't see the M2 starting at 49k personally. I predict 51-53k. I hope to be wrong and it comes under that though! But you are right, the gap won't be as big. Because we are comparing an M235i and M2 vs a regular 435i and M4.

As for the M2, it's not just an N55 with a tune, but rather N55 with S55 components. Unknown which components at this point.

Gotcha. Only time will tell....hopefully sooner than later...

[bdaddylo]

Originally Posted by Glassjaw047

Correct Again.

I just don't see how this car cannot be priced between $49K-$52K at most considering that if you look at the M235i it has M goodies to begin with at a $43,100 price point. It's not suppose to be a new engine just tuned, quad exhaust, bigger wheels, wide body, the calipers look the same(correct me if I am wrong) but drilled rotors added, DCT, LSD? and blue stitching in the seats. With the 435i ($46,250) and M4 ($64,200), a $17,950 starting price difference but with way more M Goodies/Performance Parts and a totally different engine. Your thoughts again on this?

The pricing differences between the M235 and the M2 are as follows:

+ ///M Development time, but a lot less than the M3/4
+ Wider body panels
+ M3/4 suspension
+ M3/4 brakes
+ M3/4 Wheels
+ M3/4 LSD
+ M3/4 Steering Rack
+ Quad Exhaust
+ M3/4 Side Mirrors
+ ///MDCT

In addition to this the M2 will have more ///M badges as most ///M part carry the badge (i.e., control arms, body molding, etc.).

[dmboone25]

Originally Posted by Glassjaw047

Correct Again.

I just don't see how this car cannot be priced between $49K-$52K at most considering that if you look at the M235i it has M goodies to begin with at a $43,100 price point. It's not suppose to be a new engine just tuned, quad exhaust, bigger wheels, wide body, the calipers look the same(correct me if I am wrong) but drilled rotors added, DCT, LSD? and blue stitching in the seats. With the 435i ($46,250) and M4 ($64,200), a $17,950 starting price difference but with way more M Goodies/Performance Parts and a totally different engine. Your thoughts again on this?

Other than the badges, I am not sure what ///M goodies the 235 ever received.

the +20 BHP over the standard N55 is simply the PPK...no higher of a redline...the wheels aren't any bigger or wider than on the 135...no mechanical LSD...no DCT...no ///M brakes...perhaps they fiddled a little with the suspension, but I honestly could never tell that was the case, as there was no appreciable difference (suspension/dampening wise) between comfort/sport/sport+ from my vantage point...

The M2 will check all those boxes, whether or not is has a CF roof, hood bulge, or florescent yellow stitching (or whatever it is that people want)...

PS - I am not being facetious or flippant - I am curious as to what "goodies" the 235 has that you refer to?

[swagon]

M Performance cars, as far as I know, have no M GmbH goodies. They are sligthly more tuned towards sportiness compared to the M Sport models they are based on, but again, no M GmbH stuff. There are some hardware changes, yes, as well as software.

[SCOTT26]

Let me re-iterate.
If you are too busy focusing on stitching or colour over any priority contributing aspect of the M2 that matters.

Then the M2 will not be the car for you.

[dmboone25]

Originally Posted by swagon

M Performance cars, as far as I know, have no M GmbH goodies. They are sligthly more tuned towards sportiness compared to the M Sport models they are based on, but again, no M GmbH stuff. There are some hardware changes, yes, as well as software.

That was my point.

The M2, from a handling standpoint, will be far superior to the 235.

[swagon]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

Let me re-iterate.
If you are too busy focusing on stitching or colour over any priority contributing aspect of the M2 that matters.

Then the M2 will not be the car for you.

Originally Posted by dmboone25

The M2, from a handling standpoint, will be far superior to the 235.

Of course. How's this even a discussion topic I don't know.

[PackPride85]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

Let me re-iterate.
If you are too busy focusing on stitching or colour over any priority contributing aspect of the M2 that matters.

Then the M2 will not be the car for you.

Does the type of seat matter? As in, same as m235 vs m3/4?

[fuddman]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

Let me re-iterate.
If you are too busy focusing on stitching or colour over any priority contributing aspect of the M2 that matters.

Then the M2 will not be the car for you.

Is it OK to focus on a carbon fiber roof, then?

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

Let me re-iterate.
If you are too busy focusing on stitching or colour over any priority contributing aspect of the M2 that matters.
Then the M2 will not be the car for you.

Let's discuss the importance of a circular shaped gas cap (replacing the rectangular shaped gas cap) and whether M2 cupholders will feature a sliding cover alike the ones of the F30 3 Series LCI.

[hyperzulu]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

Let me re-iterate.
If you are too busy focusing on stitching or colour over any priority contributing aspect of the M2 that matters.

Then the M2 will not be the car for you.

What are we supposed to focus on? How well it drives? How the hell are we supposed to do that? How are we supposed to focus on anything other than the hint at stitching we see in spy shots and covered body panels? How about you release the car already and then we can focus on what's important? Until then we will focus on minutiae.

[SCOTT26]

No once again it is déjà vu.
Some of you allowed yourself to focus on the minor details whilst overlooking the areas that deemed the 1er M Coupe a fantastic car.
Now it is happening again.
Some of you missed out last time because of this. It would be foolish if you done the same again.

It will come when it comes. Not when you want it to come.

[TitanSteel]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

Let me re-iterate.
If you are too busy focusing on stitching or colour over any priority contributing aspect of the M2 that matters.

Then the M2 will not be the car for you.

Agreed. As a former 1M owner, I could care less about the seats. My biggest concerns are with the purity of the driving experience (hopefully simpler and more back-to-basics than the M4), unique detailing to differentiate it as a truly special M car, and rarity (hopefully keeping production right around the same as the 1M). It is shaping up to be all of that, but I just hope it turns out to be as special as the 1M was.

[Hazey82]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

Let me re-iterate.
If you are too busy focusing on stitching or colour over any priority contributing aspect of the M2 that matters.

Then the M2 will not be the car for you.

Oh please.... I or the rest of us don't care about stitching! That is not the issue. The issue is BMW is holding this car back instead of making it shine and be the standout drivers car. Who cares about 1M that's done and dusted and was a parts bin car. My point is why hold it back by not giving it the goodies like M seats and CF roof

You lot forget that the reason you are looking at the M2 is because you want the old school M3 sizes, that's the REAL reason its being made. M4 is too big and we want small agile M car same size as e30,e36 and e46 days. So again why not give it the additional goodies as I've mentioned.

You can talk about you don't care about seats you can swap them out blah blah BUT the point is I should not have to when paying this money on a car that is supposed to be the "drivers car" pick over the entire M range. As was mentioned earlier other manufacturers can do it on less priced cars so BMW can do it! We are the M enthusiasts and BMW should listen and you lot need to wake up and realise your being sold a 3/4 baked M car!