[ZM2]

Hey guys.

I need some more negative camber in the front (like most everyone here). Is this best achieved with camber plates or coil overs and lowering the car?

Pros/Cons to these two approaches? (Cost, comfort, performance, etc).

Thanks!

PS. I understand that these are two different upgrades. I'm looking at this as: if coil overs will take care of the negative camber issue, then I could apply the cost of installing plates towards coil overs, assuming comfort isn't negatively impacted and the performance upgrade to coil overs is worth the additional cost over just plates.

[M2joey]

It turns out you need camper plates to adjust camber in the front no matter what. If you where to install coilovers without camber plates you will still be at stock camber.

From a cost perspective, you can just install camber plates with the stock suspension. There are pros and cons to this approach though.

Cons:
-You will be buying camber plates that may only work with the stock strut mount. They will not work with most coilovers
-Should you decided to install coilovers you will need to pay the some of the same labor twice.
-No change at all in comfort / ride

Pro:
-Savings of not buying coilovers
-Maintenance costs of some coilover kits after XX number of track days, total miles or racing time (Ohlins R&T as an example requires servicing 10 hours of racing time, max of 20 hours or approx. 18,000 street miles).
-Major change in comfort, some for the better.
-Much better for the track of course

I installed Ground Control plates without coilovers. I am planning on moving to the M Performance coilovers over summer or next spring. The GC plates with the stock mount support both stock struts and the MP coilovers.

[ZM2]

Great breakdown. Thanks isjoey.

I think I'll go with the Vorshlag plates for now and add the MP coilovers and corner balance down the road.

PS. You were looking good at Summit this weekend with just your plates and 4S's! I think I may try 265/285 4S's and hopefully no rubbing with the plates installed. Are you able to see how much clearance you have with your 255's upfront?

[M2joey]

Originally Posted by ZM2

Great breakdown. Thanks isjoey.

I think I'll go with the Vorshlag plates for now and add the MP coilovers and corner balance down the road.

PS. You were looking good at Summit this weekend with just your plates and 4S's! I think I may try 265/285 4S's and hopefully no rubbing with the plates installed. Are you able to see how much clearance you have with your 255's upfront?

Sure thing!

Certainly cannot go wrong with Vorshlag. I also had corner balance / weighting done, for two people and a full tank of gas. Should have had it for an empty tank of gas as every time I look I am out of gas.

Thanks. Seemed to be good, front wear is pretty good/even, little more wear than I thought I might have on the outside of the fronts but not bad. I think I will be going with 265/285s next time. You will be fine with 265 up front with or without camber plates. I have noticed a few people are doing this without any issues.

[ZM2]

Cool. I'll definitely go ahead with a track focused alignment when the plates are installed in a couple weeks. Any tips on settings?

Also, how much was the cost and benefit for the corner balance? Just trying to decide if I do that now and again later with the coil overs, or just wait.

Thanks!

[M2joey]

Originally Posted by ZM2

Cool. I'll definitely go ahead with a track focused alignment when the plates are installed in a couple weeks. Any tips on settings?

Also, how much was the cost and benefit for the corner balance? Just trying to decide if I do that now and again later with the coil overs, or just wait.

Thanks!

In regards to suspension settings. I would say the following...

Front:
Camber = -2.5 to -2.8, stock is -1.3
Total Toe = 0.00 to 0.10 - some are running 0.00, stock is 0.16. You might want to stay a little conservative and take a smaller step like 0.10.

Rear:
Camber = -1.8 to max of -2.0, stock is -1.8/-1.6
Total Toe = Seeing specs in this forum with 0.16 to 0.20, which is very aggressive. My shops system pulled 0.26 from BMW. I am still working on validating the US specs as my M2 had 0.21 stock. The alignment was very out of wack all around stock.

Google the benefits of corner balancing. Most shops will include the corner balance/weighting as part of the alignment. RRT, where I go, charges $175 for a "aggressive alignment" that includes corner balancing.

[ZM2]

Awesome. Thanks for your input!

[CosmosMpower]

You won't get nearly enough camber just by lowering the car. You can't corner balance with stock suspension.

[ZM2]

Got it. Thanks Cosmos.

[Twt]

Originally Posted by isjoey

In regards to suspension settings. I would say the following...

Front:
Camber = -2.5 to -2.8, stock is -1.3
Total Toe = 0.00 to 0.10 - some are running 0.00, stock is 0.16. You might want to stay a little conservative and take a smaller step like 0.10.

Rear:
Camber = -1.8 to max of -2.0, stock is -1.8/-1.6
Total Toe = Seeing specs in this forum with 0.16 to 0.20, which is very aggressive. My shops system pulled 0.26 from BMW. I am still working on validating the US specs as my M2 had 0.21 stock. The alignment was very out of wack all around stock.

Google the benefits of corner balancing. Most shops will include the corner balance/weighting as part of the alignment. RRT, where I go, charges $175 for a "aggressive alignment" that includes corner balancing.

All of this is helpful, but I must clarify the above. A good alignment shop will place weight in the driver seat to perform a proper alignment based upon the drivers weight....this is NOT corner balancing. With camber plates you can definitely improve the cars handling on track. After plates, you can install coilovers which allow for height adjustment, rake, compression and rebound adjustment and corner balance...this is a $500-800 service if done by a race shop and it is worth it to an aggressive driver on track.

[M2joey]

Originally Posted by Twt

All of this is helpful, but I must clarify the above. A good alignment shop will place weight in the driver seat to perform a proper alignment based upon the drivers weight....this is NOT corner balancing. With camber plates you can definitely improve the cars handling on track. After plates, you can install coilovers which allow for height adjustment, rake, compression and rebound adjustment and corner balance...this is a $500-800 service if done by a race shop and it is worth it to an aggressive driver on track.

I had Ohlins R&T on my 335is, went through about five or so different suspension configurations. Had corner balancing done and never paid anything close to what you are saying. The shop I go to is one of the best in the DC area, you name the car they work on it for the street and or track.

[lax01]

Originally Posted by isjoey

I had Ohlins R&T on my 335is, went through about five or so different suspension configurations. Had corner balancing done and never paid anything close to what you are saying. The shop I go to is one of the best in the DC area, you name the car they work on it for the street and or track.

Depends on the shop and how much time they put in...you can definitely find $500+ corner balance and alignment when the shop spends 5-8 hours and does it by hand.