[SW19]

That would be awesome news if it is true.The only negative thing would be that the S55 exhaust doesn't sound as good as the N55 exhaust in the M2.

[mike@x-ph.com]

if true it would be awesome news

Highly doubt it though, M2 with S55 engine would hurt the M3 / M4 sales

[stren]

Originally Posted by BMW M3 CRT

Source seems to be reliable, more I couldn't say (www.f30-forum.de) !!!

Two reasons why its seems real:

• The N55B30 couldn't fullfil future emmisions laws and this engine is an outgoing project since it is replaced in most BMW models with the B58!
• In 03/2017 the standart M3/M4 will be upgraded to 450PS - CP to ~475PS ... this makes room for an M2 with 400PS!

The 400PS S55 is for the standart M2 ... an price increase is without a question possible.

1a - The N54 was still used for 135is, 335is and 1/M many years after it was replaced by the N55 in the mainstream x35 cars.

1b - Emissions are very similar - 199 c02 for m2 vs 194-204 for the M4. This is therefore not a reason to change.

2 - There was always room for a detuned S55 below the M3/M4. Nothing new here - if they were going to do it, they could have done it already.



Valid reasons for an S55 engine change:

1. To compete with times of the 1LE and GT350R which are killing it performance wise.

- to counter this - they don't compete in the same market. Audi and Merc don't have anything close to the M2. Infiniti just got an engine but forgot the transmission and lexus has weight problems. Cadillac is fugly and got railed on for the cue system.

2. To have an excuse to raise the price and reduce demand as well as the M240i overlap

- to counter this - BMW can already sell M240i's to people not willing to wait for the M2. Raising the price doesn't mean more profit as the S55 is presumably more expensive.

3. Because the S55 was the weakest part of the car in review

- to counter this - the car was universally praised. The S55 would be better although plenty of M3/M4 reviewers didn't like how the S55's torque could surprise them.

4. Because it reduces production costs of the CSL/GTS car

- to counter this - maybe but maybe not. The CSL/GTS car will most likely be a zero profit halo car exercise anyway. Any gain/loss is small compared to the ///Marketing. Plus while we assume the GTS will get an S55 - for all we know BMW might have some 4 cylinder skunkworks engine for a CSL. We don't even know if it will be a CSL or GTS or both.

5. BMW were worried about eating into M3/M4 sales but have not seen a dip. Much like Porsche were worried about the Cayman and the 911, they realize there is demand for both.

- to counter this - why spend money to change it that won't be recouped?



None of these are compelling enough for the base car IMO. They all make sense and BMW may do it, and I hope they do, but I'd be surprised. After all - "don't fix what isn't broken". Any engineering expense won't be recouped by the low sales volume and any marketing bump would be obscured by the GTS/CSL anyway.

However if BMW are reading, none of this is true. Please give us the detuned S55 and the m4 seats, also red leather option pls. Please don't charge us more and while you're at it I'd like a winning lottery ticket :lol

[Aronis]

Sounds like a very reasonable approach. Most buyers keep their cars stock. So as long as they detune it the M3/4 remain top dog. But current M2 kept up with the M4, so I would suspect they up the anti with the M3/4 hp numbers.

This simplifies supply (same engine), and keeps it simpler at the service end. More mechanics with more experience with the same engine.

Audi's 4.0 Liter V8 with Twin turbo is used in S6/S7/A8L/S8/RS6/RS7/ etc with different tunes and minor intake differences (yes better crank/pistons in the RS versions) but still the service is similar.

The N55 is maxed out. BMW knows that, and each year they do one thing, INCREASE power output. That drives their own sales.....current M2 guy might sell/trade the M2 for the new M2 etc.

Mike

[Marshman222]

Anyone have a source on this?

[Nine Lives]

Originally Posted by ried

Believe it when you see it. That just doesn't happen during an M car's product lifecycle. When did we have a major engine swap, even at LCI? You have to go all the way back to the clown shoe in 2001 for that.

Believe it when you see it, folks.

Why should BMW be seen to adhere to any life cycle pattern.
There's a lot of competition just around the corner and BMW might want to keep the crown now they have a winning formula.

Originally Posted by Nantucket

That would be awesome news if it is true.The only negative thing would be that the S55 exhaust doesn't sound as good as the N55 exhaust in the M2.

I'm sure there will be a work around

[stren]

I believe this is the post in question:

http://www.f30-forum.de/board1-f30-f...tml#post185856

Posted by "M-Power", google translate:

So, you boys and girls ... Some of you know where I was at the weekend and I have driven there ... the others I may not tell ... But a little hint I would like geben- and it indirectly affects the M3 / M4 statement: "As of March the M2 gets the S55 under the Haube- with smooth 400 hp Because from then a little air is indeed up ...!"

[Nine Lives]

Originally Posted by stren

Valid reasons for an S55 engine change:

1. To compete with times of the 1LE and GT350R which are killing it performance wise.

- to counter this - they don't compete in the same market. Audi and Merc don't have anything close to the M2.

It's in the post...

New Mercedes-Benz amg A45 with 400bhp for Europe,possibly same engine for cla elsewhere.

Audit ttrs with 400bhp

A new Ford Focus RS rumoured to have 400bhp.

I'm sure BMW won't want to be left behind now they have a winner on their hands.

[oolas3]

Originally Posted by Nine Lives

It's in the post...

New Mercedes-Benz amg A45 with 400bhp for Europe,possibly same engine for cla elsewhere.

Audit ttrs with 400bhp

A new Ford Focus RS rumoured to have 400bhp.

I'm sure BMW won't want to be left behind now they have a winner on their hands.

+1. This is why this time could be different. Also, the M CEO is originally from outside the company so probably less influenced by the way things have always been done.

[PackPride85]

LOL not happening. It was already confirmed in the leaked model info thread that the M2 would continue to use the N55 through the LCI next year.

[stren]

Originally Posted by Nine Lives

It's in the post...

New Mercedes-Benz amg A45 with 400bhp for Europe,possibly same engine for cla elsewhere.

Audit ttrs with 400bhp

A new Ford Focus RS rumoured to have 400bhp.

I'm sure BMW won't want to be left behind now they have a winner on their hands.

I see AWD hatchback buyers and RWD luxuryish coupe buyers as different market segments though with limited crossover. Most M2 buyers aren't buying the car purely as the "best track car under 60k", because it isn't.

TTRS and CLA might hurt them but only if they deliver. The RS3 and current CLA didn't. Not a reason to stand still, but again nothing that a CSL/GTS wouldn't crush.

[Adem1534]

Originally Posted by stren

I believe this is the post in question:

http://www.f30-forum.de/board1-f30-f...tml#post185856

Posted by "M-Power", google translate:

...

That means absolutely nothing

[ChrisK]

It would kill M3/M4 Sales - never going to happen.

[gmzanatta]

Originally Posted by Adem1534

...

That means absolutely nothing

I mean, if this is the source standards we're being held to, I can now officially announce all M2 owners that purchased their cars before March 2017 will get a free engine upgrade to the S55. That is FACT.

[stren]

Originally Posted by Adem1534

...

That means absolutely nothing

Yeah I was gonna stalk the user and see what other posts to see if they had any credibility. But I'd need to register and that was too much effort

[bogeyman]

It happened with the E30 M3 2.3 -> 2.5 engine.

Also with the E36 M3 3.0 -> 3.2

Maybe they'll call it a M2 Evolution.

It'd be pretty harsh on current M2 owners though.

Originally Posted by ried

Believe it when you see it. That just doesn't happen during an M car's product lifecycle. When did we have a major engine swap, even at LCI? You have to go all the way back to the clown shoe in 2001 for that.

Believe it when you see it, folks.

[DrKevM5]

I call serious bullshit

[Nine Lives]

Originally Posted by DrKevM5

I call serious bullshit

Don't sweat it Kev !

It's only an additional 30hp and you still have a fine car

[TunedM2C]

SCOTT26 Any truth to this?

[Bmwbb]

I highly doubted that is true but I will give my dealer a call tomorrow. I am sure they will know something if a new engine will be used in 2017 model.

[PackPride85]

Originally Posted by Bmwbb

I highly doubted that is true but I will give my dealer a call tomorrow. I am sure they will know something if a new engine will be used in 2017 model.

No they won't.

[BruceM]

Originally Posted by Bmwbb

I highly doubted that is true but I will give my dealer a call tomorrow. I am sure they will know something if a new engine will be used in 2017 model.

Already asked my SA, who, unlike the vast majority of the SAs I've dealt with over the last many months, actually seems to know shit about the cars he is trying to sell. He says he has not heard of this swap, thinks by now he would have if it were happening by next March, and says he has a hard time understanding such a move "internally" at this point. But he also doesn't understand why BMW is treating the M2 the way it is, so he knows he is not totally wired in to the BMW braintrust.