[Maximoosh]

Interesting video... I was very angry when Porsche went with this 4cyl setup. Bear in mind this is the "hot" GTS variant and it really makes the M2 seem like a very good alternative... that it runs so close to a properly focussed sportscar is testament to the M2s abilities. Also notice how the guy is actually laughing when hes driving the bimmer. Good review.

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by Maximoosh

[VIDEO]
Interesting video... I was very angry when Porsche went with this 4cyl setup. Bear in mind this is the "hot" GTS variant and it really makes the M2 seem like a very good alternative... that it runs so close to a properly focussed sportscar is testament to the M2s abilities. Also notice how the guy is actually laughing when hes driving the bimmer. Good review.

BMW continues the trend of the punching above its " class ".

The 1M was very favorably compared to the Cayman R.

The M2 is very favorably compared to the Boxster/Cayman GTS.

The BMW is the better daily and the Porsche is the better sportscar , for about 30 percent more $$.

[Artemis]

Sorry to say, but to my ears and mind, the 4-pot turbo-charged sound of the 718 Porsche is rather sobering, when compared to the sweet NA flat-six orchestra of the past. With losing 1/3 of its cylinder lay-out and the swap from NA to turbo-charge, you may as well bar 1/3 of the letters from the badge: from "Porsche" to a sterile, windy "Psche". An extra GTS badge and some GTS sound tuning, won't help much.

"But it drives so damn well, and that's what it's all about in the end, doesn't it ? It's a Porsche !": sure, no doubt that Porsche did its homework properly, as usual, but engine & exhaust sound matters too for facilitating emotional connection. And, personally, hi-tech lawnmower sounds don't particularly thrill me, no matter what brand or sophistication. Given the money that you pay for this car, its sound is rather something to get 'underwhelmed' about, or 'whelmed' at best. But not 'overwhelmed'.

Look, Coca-Cola Zero Sugar definitely has a Coca-Cola taste to it, it has been meticulously conceived and promoted by The Coca-Cola Company as genuine Coca-Cola, it's undoubtedly healthier, etc. ...but I prefer the taste of the good old regular one. We knew how it used to be, so we can compare the new iterations to the old(er) ones to realize whether the new kid in town still got all the soul and swag of its ancestors (the way we liked it).

Previous generation "Porsche" Boxster & Cayman: yes. The 718 generation: sorry, can't see myself ever buying one of those "Psche", except if it features a flat-six on board (fortunately, almost all rumors hint to NA flat-six for the forthcoming Cayman GT4).

[bernstem]

Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster

The BMW is the better daily and the Porsche is the better sportscar , for about 30 percent more $$.

And there lies the elephant. In the US, a comparably equipped 718 is 90k+ compared to 60k for the M2. A base M2 is 55k vs 80k for the 718.

I'll take an M2, thanks. Drop the price on the 718 to 60k, and the equation is different.

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by bernstem

And there lies the elephant. In the US, a comparably equipped 718 is 90k+ compared to 60k for the M2. A base M2 is 55k vs 80k for the 718.

I'll take an M2, thanks. Drop the price on the 718 to 60k, and the equation is different.

My position on that was likely permanently solidified by seeing that article about the average profit on a bmw is about 5k and the average profit on a Porsche is 17k.


https://www.motor1.com/news/139712/p...r-vehicle/amp/


Hell if I want to get robbed I'll just hang out in questionable areas.

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Sorry to say, but to my ears and mind, the 4-pot turbo-charged sound of the 718 Porsche is rather sobering, when compared to the sweet NA flat-six orchestra of the past. With losing 1/3 of its cylinder lay-out and the swap from NA to turbo-charge, you may as well bar 1/3 of the letters from the badge: from "Porsche" to a sterile, windy "Psche". An extra GTS badge and some GTS sound tuning, won't help much.

"But it drives so damn well, and that's what it's all about in the end, doesn't it ? It's a Porsche !": sure, no doubt that Porsche did its homework properly, as usual, but engine & exhaust sound matters too for facilitating emotional connection. And, personally, hi-tech lawnmower sounds don't particularly thrill me, no matter what brand or sophistication. Given the money that you pay for this car, its sound is rather something to get 'underwhelmed' about, or 'whelmed' at best. But not 'overwhelmed'.

Look, Coca-Cola Zero Sugar definitely has a Coca-Cola taste to it, it has been meticulously conceived and promoted by The Coca-Cola Company as genuine Coca-Cola, it's undoubtedly healthier, etc. ...but I prefer the taste of the good old regular one. We knew how it used to be, so we can compare the new iterations to the old(er) ones to realize whether the new kid in town still got all the soul and swag of its ancestors (the way we liked it).

Previous generation "Porsche" Boxster & Cayman: yes. The 718 generation: sorry, can't see myself ever buying one of those "Psche", except if it features a flat-six on board (fortunately, almost all rumors hint to NA flat-six for the forthcoming Cayman GT4).

I was offered a sample of that Coke Zero sugar on a college campus this summer. I literally nearly spat it out. It was just as horrible as the prior Coke Zero. And hell no that's not a coke.

[qnet]

All criticisms aside, the 718 is a nice-looking car.

[Romo]

Hear hear hear;

The Boxsters gearbox isn't as sweet as the BMW`s


Wel this is what I said I while ago, how good actually the BMW 6MT is, it is BY FAR, the best MT ever made by BMW.

That said; it is a very precisely manual, so you have to operate precise!


The only alternative for the M2 is the coming NA F6 718 GT4, on 2nd thought, Ill have them both !

[bobert]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Sorry to say, but to my ears and mind, the 4-pot turbo-charged sound of the 718 Porsche is rather sobering, when compared to the sweet NA flat-six orchestra of the past.
...
"But it drives so damn well, and that's what it's all about in the end, doesn't it ? It's a Porsche !": sure, no doubt that Porsche did its homework properly, as usual, but engine & exhaust sound matters too for facilitating emotional connection.
...
Previous generation "Porsche" Boxster & Cayman: yes. The 718 generation: sorry, can't see myself ever buying one of those "Psche", except if it features a flat-six on board (fortunately, almost all rumors hint to NA flat-six for the forthcoming Cayman GT4).

I couldn't agree more - I love my father's 2017 Cayman S almost as much as my 2018 M2, but my M2 has one big advantage (cost savings aside): it sounds much better.

[Maximoosh]

Originally Posted by qnet

All criticisms aside, the 718 is a nice-looking car.

The looks are spot on, the handling too. But that engine is too much of a compromise, ive driven a few of them at Porsches facility at Silverstone. It was fast....... but that sound..... not for me at all. Its like having a delicious pasta dish, and then putting 2 entire naga chillies in it, the crappy sound dominates everything, no matter how good the base dish was.

[Maximoosh]

Originally Posted by bobert

I couldn't agree more - I love my father's 2017 Cayman S almost as much as my 2018 M2, but my M2 has one big advantage (cost savings aside): it sounds much better.

Nice colour!

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by Maximoosh

The looks are spot on, the handling too. But that engine is too much of a compromise, ive driven a few of them at Porsches facility at Silverstone. It was fast....... but that sound..... not for me at all. Its like having a delicious pasta dish, and then putting 2 entire naga chillies in it, the crappy sound dominates everything, no matter how good the base dish was.

Listen to what Chris Harris said about the 718. Amen to that.

[BruceM]

Originally Posted by Romo

Hear hear hear;

The Boxsters gearbox isn't as sweet as the BMW`s


Wel this is what I said I while ago, how good actually the BMW 6MT is, it is BY FAR, the best MT ever made by BMW.

That said; it is a very precisely manual, so you have to operate precise!


The only alternative for the M2 is the coming NA F6 718 GT4, on 2nd thought, Ill have them both !

I like the M2, a lot, for several reasons. But I wasn't really impressed with the MT out of the box. The stick throws felt too long, the engagement too easy and a bit mushy, the pedal resistance way too light and the pedal stroke too long with an indistinct catch point. But a good SSK and the UCP fixed what was ailing me. Now the MT is excellent. It's not first-generation NSX good, but it is still very good.

[M3 Adjuster]

Originally Posted by BruceM

I like the M2, a lot, for several reasons. But I wasn't really impressed with the MT out of the box. The stick throws felt too long, the engagement too easy and a bit mushy, the pedal resistance way too light and the pedal stroke too long with an indistinct catch point. But a good SSK and the UCP fixed what was ailing me. Now the MT is excellent. It's not first-generation NSX good, but it is still very good.

your first BMW MT?

- Long throws are a bmw staple.
- The light pedal resistance is new to the M2.
- The location of the friction point regarding the long throw has long been a complaint of many bmw owners that light to fix this with a clutch stop.
- mushy feel between gears also a bmw staple ( when compared to say, a Honda )

Glad you've found the remedies for those 'usual suspects '.

[Romo]

IMHO;

1 The shifter is good, a little long throw, but lets not exaggerate on that
2 Shift actions are superb; however as I stated; you must be precise (clutch fully engaged, and not lift throttle too much, it will work just perfectly)

Clutch is something different;
1 Its very light indeed (compared to my previous E46 M3, E92 M3, E82 1M)
2 It has not much "feel" to it
3 It engages rather high/ late, for sportiness I would like it to be much faster

But you will get it work for you, even rev match which initially I disliked, now is perfect for DD.


My goal; M2, possibly the CS version as DD, the coming 718 GT4 PDK as a weekend warrior, the perfect plan to me

[Romo]

The 718 Boxster /Cayman series (I`ve test-driven them all) are superb sports-cars of course, but IMHO Porsche made too much sacrifice on the engine bringing it back from 6 to 4 cilinders.

I also used to own a 981 Cayman GTS, which is the best sounding engine I`ve ever heard and possessed, thinking how it sounded just gives me goosebumps once again as I write these lines

I could not buy the 4 cilinder series, how good they maybe, but for me the engine is the heart and soul of the car, any car, the 6IL M2 is just better, more mature than the 4 F Porsche.

Of course I can understand people here will decide/think differently, all due respect to that opinion, I just speak for myself compared to all my previous cars. That is why the only alternative/follow up must be, can only be the 718 GT4. I`m really anxious for that car, as it maybe the last NA 6F Cayman.

Counting the days..............


My previous CGTS;

Set speaker to max sound

[BruceM]

Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster

your first BMW MT?

- Long throws are a bmw staple.
- The light pedal resistance is new to the M2.
- The location of the friction point regarding the long throw has long been a complaint of many bmw owners that light to fix this with a clutch stop.
- mushy feel between gears also a bmw staple ( when compared to say, a Honda )

Glad you've found the remedies for those 'usual suspects '.

Nope. But my first one was an e36 M3 with an SSK on it. Got used to that. My 930 came stock with a 4-speed cable-operated clutch and throws like a school bus. Swapped in a 5-speed hydraulic G50 and an SSK, and it's now much better. I have developed a very specific preference for a certain kind of shifting experience, apparently.

[RedCarrot]

“Psche” has become a punching bag of late for neutering their f6 to f4, and I think they deserve every punch that comes their way. They have a f6 2.7 ready to use but, nooooo, let’s make sure Boxster/Cayman owners that spend 60-100k on the car that they are acutely aware they are a class or two beneath Porsche’s preferred clientele.

I hope Porsche comes to its sense and put a proper f6 turbo in the next Boxster/Cayman. Otherwise it might as well discontinue the line.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by RedCarrot

“Psche” has become a punching bag of late for neutering their f6 to f4, and I think they deserve every punch that comes their way. They have a f6 2.7 ready to use but, nooooo, let’s make sure Boxster/Cayman owners that spend 60-100k on the car that they are acutely aware they are a class or two beneath Porsche’s preferred clientele.

I hope Porsche comes to its sense and put a proper f6 turbo in the next Boxster/Cayman. Otherwise it might as well discontinue the line.

Remember the 996 headlights controversy:

• 993: 'bug-eye' headlights design - a design icon of the 911 model;
• 996: 'fried egg' / 'teardrop' Boxster headlights design - "done with the old - let's change !";
• 997: 'bug-eye' headlights design reintroduced.

See: https://oppositelock.kinja.com/k-rol...993-1613328848

Also see the 996 resale prices compared to other 911.

[akkando]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Remember the 996 headlights controversy:

• 993: OK, in line with decades of 911 tradition - one of the coolest 911 ever
• 996: Nooo! Porsche, what were you thinking ?
• 997: Porsche switched back to the traditional round headlights design after understanding that lots of enthusiasts / (potential) clients didn't stomach "the fried egg" 996 headlight design.

See: https://oppositelock.kinja.com/k-rol...993-1613328848

Also see the 996 resale prices compared to other 911.

Honestly if they switch back to a flat 6 for the cayman line there are going to be some SICK deals on the used market for a 718. It's still a great driving car!

[RedCarrot]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Remember the 996 headlights controversy:

• 993: OK, in line with decades of 911 tradition - one of the coolest 911 ever
• 996: Nooo! Porsche, what were you thinking ?
• 997: Porsche switched back to the traditional round headlights design after understanding that lots of enthusiasts / (potential) clients didn't stomach "the fried egg" 996 headlight design.

See: https://oppositelock.kinja.com/k-rol...993-1613328848

Also see the 996 resale prices compared to other 911.

My thought exactly. If/when Porsche eventually puts a f6 turbo in Boxster/Cayman, the current f4 turbo version will be the bastard child of the line just like the 996 is and alway will be in the 911 realm. No way I would spend that kind of coin on a 718. The upcoming GT4 - if rumor holds true - will be amazing.

[akkando]

Originally Posted by Maximoosh

Interesting video... I was very angry when Porsche went with this 4cyl setup. Bear in mind this is the "hot" GTS variant and it really makes the M2 seem like a very good alternative... that it runs so close to a properly focussed sportscar is testament to the M2s abilities. Also notice how the guy is actually laughing when hes driving the bimmer. Good review.

I hate these kinds of video reviews. They're such trash. They do the typical format of two people, two cars, and they are scripted to pick opposite cars and have a fake debate on which one is better. It just reeks of being scripted bullshit and every time I see one of these I just think I should start my own youtube channel for reviews because even I could do better than this, but then I remember there is a reason they use this format, and it's because most viewers are stupid and likes the format, so never mind.