[GimmeanM]

^^well said @Gatte

I'll stick to my guns...if it's limited production and reasonable pricing...I'm in!!

[Bimmed Out]

Originally Posted by F87LUV

Lol. Ehhh not saying it won't but I was on the fence with the 911 vs M2 to begin with. I realize they're not comparable but regardless those were my two choices. The 911 is a classic that I've always loved.

I can tell you from having owned several 911s across different generations, other than the model name and basic overall shape (and perhaps engine placement, but that is reportedly going to change a bit, too), very little about today's 911 is classic.

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by KELVIN7

If M2 CS is selling around $75K, then who's gonna buy M4? Lol....

People who think the M2 has an ugly rear end with a crappy interior.

I hope they don't kill this version by making it DCT only like the GTS.

[bimmer4life24]

Originally Posted by Gatte

Relax with the price speculation. BMW would try to compete with other manufacturers more than within their own lineup. For example, they would not mind someone buying an M2 instead of the M3 as much as they would someone buying a C45 AMG or RS3 instead of the M2.

First and foremost, BMW will need to compete with those models and maybe even the GT4 from a price perspective provided of course the performance matches. You need to look at what the competitors are pricing their models at before we start with the M3/M4 blah blah or 130K blah blah...... blah.

If the M2 CS when it releases cannot destroy the newer GT4 which is also expected at that time, it will not be priced over the GT4. As a matter of fact, it would be priced at least 5K-10K under that price because it's not a Porsche. The M2 CS is getting 400 HP because the new Audi and Merc models in the same market space are getting updated as well. The pricing will also need to compete with those models if the base M2 is not able to compete with the newer Audi and Merc offerings.

THIS EXACTLY

Couldn't agree with you more, man.

[dmboone25]

Originally Posted by Gatte

Relax with the price speculation. BMW would try to compete with other manufacturers more than within their own lineup. For example, they would not mind someone buying an M2 instead of the M3 as much as they would someone buying a C45 AMG or RS3 instead of the M2.

First and foremost, BMW will need to compete with those models and maybe even the GT4 from a price perspective provided of course the performance matches. You need to look at what the competitors are pricing their models at before we start with the M3/M4 blah blah or 130K blah blah...... blah.

If the M2 CS when it releases cannot destroy the newer GT4 which is also expected at that time, it will not be priced over the GT4. As a matter of fact, it would be priced at least 5K-10K under that price because it's not a Porsche. The M2 CS is getting 400 HP because the new Audi and Merc models in the same market space are getting updated as well. The pricing will also need to compete with those models if the base M2 is not able to compete with the newer Audi and Merc offerings.

Originally Posted by bimmer4life24

THIS EXACTLY

Couldn't agree with you more, man.

True...but I wouldn't expect the CS to be competing with the old GT4, much less a new one that will likely have more power, the quicker steering, the revised 718 chassis, etc. That's a dedicated track car - the CS isn't that, unless I am mistaken (happy to admit if I am wrong here).

The new GT4 will need to be objectively better than the original (which probably means PDK), and will absolutely cost more. Hell the 718 Boxster S is lapping the Ring only 2 seconds slower than the 981 GT4...so you know that gap is going to grow with the new GT4's ring time. The 991.2 GT3/RS models will also get more BHP, so Porsche will have more room to get the new GT4 into 400+ BHP territory. Also, the 981 --> 718 price increase is around 5K, give or take. So you have a higher starting point on the new GT4 as well.

[Gatte]

Originally Posted by dmboone25

True...but I wouldn't expect the CS to be competing with the old GT4, much less a new one that will likely have more power, the quicker steering, the revised 718 chassis, etc. That's a dedicated track car - the CS isn't that, unless I am mistaken (happy to admit if I am wrong here).

The new GT4 will need to be objectively better than the original (which probably means PDK), and will absolutely cost more. Hell the 718 Boxster S is lapping the Ring only 2 seconds slower than the 981 GT4...so you know that gap is going to grow with the new GT4's ring time. The 991.2 GT3/RS models will also get more BHP, so Porsche will have more room to get the new GT4 into 400+ BHP territory. Also, the 981 --> 718 price increase is around 5K, give or take. So you have a higher starting point on the new GT4 as well.

The logic here makes absolute sense. What I am trying to say is that, we do not know if the CS is going to compete with the new GT4 or not.

What we do know is that BMW has to release a model that will compete with the newer Merc and Audi which would both outperform the current M2 comfortably. The BMW M2 CS will in all probability be a model to do just that and will be priced accordingly. It mostly won't be limited edition either because they would want to sell as many of these as possible and take the market away from Merc and Audi.

Now for the limited edition GT4. If the M2 CS is not going to be the model to take on the GT4 and if BMW feels like it should have a model that can take on the newer GT4 and compete with it, they could at that point release another model which would also be limited like the GT4. This could be the CSL or the GTS. This model would need to be priced about 15-20K below the GT4. The New GT4 could be around 90-95K. The M2 CSL at that point would be around 75-80K is my guess. This is what happened with the M4 GTS which stickers for 135K. The Porsche GT3 RS that it goes up against starts at 176K and the difference is about 40K.

[Mike@N54Tuning.com]

Originally Posted by Jono2112

Does "slightly defined" also mean easily retuned to full power? Then of course let the after market mods begin!

I would image you will be able to tune it to the M3/M4 tuned levels.

Mike

[dmboone25]

Originally Posted by Gatte

The logic here makes absolute sense. What I am trying to say is that, we do not know if the CS is going to compete with the new GT4 or not.

What we do know is that BMW has to release a model that will compete with the newer Merc and Audi which would both outperform the current M2 comfortably. The BMW M2 CS will in all probability be a model to do just that and will be priced accordingly. It mostly won't be limited edition either because they would want to sell as many of these as possible and take the market away from Merc and Audi.

Now for the limited edition GT4. If the M2 CS is not going to be the model to take on the GT4 and if BMW feels like it should have a model that can take on the newer GT4 and compete with it, they could at that point release another model which would also be limited like the GT4. This could be the CSL or the GTS. This model would need to be priced about 15-20K below the GT4. The New GT4 could be around 90-95K. The M2 CSL at that point would be around 75-80K is my guess. This is what happened with the M4 GTS which stickers for 135K. The Porsche GT3 RS that it goes up against starts at 176K and the difference is about 40K.

Well said - now I am following you.

I personally feel as though it would likely take a CSL/GTS version of the M2 to compete with an updated GT4, but perhaps the CS is going to be a bigger leap forward than we think.

Also, in the event you're correct (and the logic makes sense) that the CS is intended to compete with MB and Audi, what happens to the base M2? Does it go away? Does the M240 get more M stuff? Is there still room for all three?

I think the combination of materials included in the CS + the price point will tell us a lot about whether an even "better" edition is somewhere down the line. The closer the CS is to the M2 base, in terms of price and kit - to me that leaves more "room" on the table for BMW to have an even more insane M2 CSL/GTS. Then the CS sort of becomes the competition package for the M2...it will be fun to watch.

[Destroya]

Originally Posted by dmboone25

Well said - now I am following you.

Also, in the event you're correct (and the logic makes sense) that the CS is intended to compete with MB and Audi, what happens to the base M2? Does it go away? Does the M240 get more M stuff? Is there still room for all three?
:

Logic says that the base M2 remains. The whole marketing concept was to make a more affordable M car to attract a new demographic and generate excitement. This strategy has succeeded. Why stop now?

[M-Pilot]

My only fear is that even if M2 CS is not officially limited production, BMW will still not make it in high quantities. Even if it's priced at $60K-$70K, many dealers will be asking significantly over MSRP claiming that "M2 was/is already a special car and M2 CS is even more special/exclusive".

A lot of us here already discussed the fact that the profit margin on a M2 is minimal considering its price difference compared to a M240i. This time BMW has a chance to combine a successful platform with a successful and proven engine at almost and maybe more than the M3/4 base price. So, the margins could be a lot better than M2's if they want to. I really hope that BMW, for once, can make this car available to whoever wants to buy it!

[dmboone25]

Originally Posted by Destroya

Logic says that the base M2 remains. The whole marketing concept was to make a more affordable M car to attract a new demographic and generate excitement. This strategy has succeeded. Why stop now?

You're probably right - I was just thinking through how the three cars will be differentiated. Perhaps the base will get a small BHP increase over time or something.

[MRufo]

Will it have the same crunching pop cans option?

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by cntzl

My only fear is that even if M2 CS is not officially limited production, BMW will still not make it in high quantities. Even if it's priced at $60K-$70K, many dealers will be asking significantly over MSRP claiming that "M2 was/is already a special car and M2 CS is even more special/exclusive".

A lot of us here already discussed the fact that the profit margin on a M2 is minimal considering its price difference compared to a M240i. This time BMW has a chance to combine a successful platform with a successful and proven engine at almost and maybe more than the M3/4 base price. So, the margins could be a lot better than M2's if they want to. I really hope that BMW, for once, can make this car available to whoever wants to buy it!

Not sure Ill buy it or not but I'm #1 on the M2 CS list at my dealer. Want to get it for the wife. The nice thing is they don't ever go over MSRP as corporate policy. They generally give me a minimum of 1k off even on new stuff so crossing fingers there.

If it ends up being DCT only its an instant deal breaker.

[M2MG17]

I heard from a little birdy that M2 CS will be just under 100k.

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by SAPPHIREM4GTS

I heard from a little birdy that M2 CS will be just under 100k.

Needs to be about 75k or an M4 will look more attractive IMO.

[M2MG17]

It will be 80-90k ish is my guess based on M4 GTS pricing model.

This is positioned above a standard M4 and under a M4 CS and GTS.

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by SAPPHIREM4GTS

It will be 80-90k ish is my guess based on M4 GTS pricing model.

This is positioned above a standard M4 and under a M4 CS and GTS.

Yeah but more than an M4 ZCP which I would take over an M2 CS. The M2 CS really needs a CFRP and interior upgrades if its going up that high IMO.

[Gatte]

Originally Posted by dmboone25

Well said - now I am following you.

I personally feel as though it would likely take a CSL/GTS version of the M2 to compete with an updated GT4, but perhaps the CS is going to be a bigger leap forward than we think.

Also, in the event you're correct (and the logic makes sense) that the CS is intended to compete with MB and Audi, what happens to the base M2? Does it go away? Does the M240 get more M stuff? Is there still room for all three?

I think the combination of materials included in the CS + the price point will tell us a lot about whether an even "better" edition is somewhere down the line. The closer the CS is to the M2 base, in terms of price and kit - to me that leaves more "room" on the table for BMW to have an even more insane M2 CSL/GTS. Then the CS sort of becomes the competition package for the M2...it will be fun to watch.

That's right. We won't know until we get more information on what the CS will have/not have. Everything would make perfect sense if the base M2 was to get a power bump or if the M2 CS was to replace the base M2. It has been speculated that it would be replacing the base M2 although nothing is known for sure. This is what it could be in 2018/2019:

M240i --> Audi S3
M2/M2 CS --> Audi RS3/Merc C45 AMG
M2 CS --> Audi TT RS/Porsche 718
M2 CSL --> Porsche GT4

We'll know more as time passes I guess.

[M2MG17]

Originally Posted by dmk08

Yeah but more than an M4 ZCP which I would take over an M2 CS. The M2 CS really needs a CFRP and interior upgrades if its going up that high IMO.

Yes probably will have CF aero parts and alcantara interior with upgraded seats with 19/20 forged wheels and sport cup 2 tires with titanium exhaust etc....

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by SAPPHIREM4GTS

Yes probably will have CF aero parts and alcantara interior with upgraded seats with 19/20 forged wheels and sport cup 2 tires with titanium exhaust etc....

The original picture didnt have a Carbon Fiber Roof.. But if they add that and upgraded interior I would go to a higher price for sure.

[M-Pilot]

I wouldn't pay more than $80k for this car but I'm sure BMW won't have any problem seeling it even at that price range.

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by cntzl

I wouldn't pay more than $80k for this car but I'm sure BMW won't have any problem seeling it even at that price range.

Yeah I mean look at the dumb prices people paid for the GTS..