[mofomat]

Originally Posted by omasou

Perhaps this is the one that you're remembering?

http://www.topgear.com/videos/chris-...e-bmw-1m-coupe

No. This is an old video and I've no idea why it's being described as "Chris Harris drives the M2 again".

It was originally broadcast on Top Gear 26th June 2016.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_Gear_(series_23)

[DTNJNQ]

Agree. This is an old video that was discussed 6 months ago.

http://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...t=Chris+Harris

[edwinm3]

"you can get a DCT if you want but trust me, you don't"

[medphysdave]

Originally Posted by evanescent03

RS3 will be a bore compared to the M2 for anyone who likes driving hard and doesn't mind a smaller, less accessible back seat. for anyone needing the back seat and wants some pizzaz, but willing to sacrifice the ability to do burnouts and clutch dumps, the RS3 will be a winner. (I have a tuned S3. I wanted it to be a smaller, cheaper replacement for my M3 but it's just not nearly as satisfying. I got stuck with the S3 because it tanked in price so I had to add a camaro 1LE for my RWD kicks).

I'd like to read your 1LE experience. Pros/cons. It looks great.

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by omasou

M2 really is the modern M3, it reminds me a lot of my E36M3 but with 100+ HP, and loving how it is simplified or maybe more correct not overly complicated, no adaptive suspension, etc. I might have even selected manual seats if they were an option in the US.

The real E36 M3 had 321hp

[Robin_NL]

Originally Posted by CanAutM3

The real E36 M3 had 321hp

We overhere also had the 3.0 286 DIN HP version. Later in 97 came the 3.2 321HP version which we tested with the new SMG box in Germany .I worked at a BMW dealership back then.

Cheers
Robin

[CanAutM3]

Originally Posted by Robin_NL

We overhere also had the 3.0 286 DIN HP version. Later in 97 came the 3.2 321HP version which we tested with the new SMG box in Germany .I worked at a BMW dealership back then.

Cheers
Robin

We were also lucky enough to get a limited run of the 286ps 3.0l engine in the E36 M3 here in Canada

Sadly, when the E36 M3 was introduced in the US at a later time, they gave us the same downgraded engine .

[evanescent03]

Originally Posted by medphysdave

I'd like to read your 1LE experience. Pros/cons. It looks great.

I'll send you a PM .. don't want to detail the thread .. but, in short, it's a mean ride. faster, louder, harder, less refined and therefore less comfortable day to day.

[evilalien]

Harris is entertaining. The M2 looks like a hell of a lot of fun. I care about what it is, not what it is badged as, what it is similar to in the past, or what is the "true and proper BMW". Nostalgia is fine and good, but reality wins and BMW decides what a BMW is today and in the future. I voted with my dollar, and love the scale of the current 2-series even if years ago it'd be badged as a 3.

Seems like lots of this going on...

[Semi-Poor]

Originally Posted by 2M

Anyone know any vendors selling gloss black M3 badges?

IND

[Dinh335]

Originally Posted by AngryBaby

The F80 M3 is a great car. The F87 M2 is a great car. One sacrifices driving dynamics for luxury. The other sacrifices luxury for dynamics (and price). Both represent different aspects of the Motorsport division and we each buy whichever matches our individual priorities. Maybe some day BMW will nail the best of both worlds.

I get your premise, and have no desire to enter an m3 vs m2 debate...but what is with this bandwagon that the m3 and m4 are huge luxury focused cars?

If the m2 didn't exist no one would say that. It's an over exagerrated line of thinking that the 3 series moved upscale and have becomes this luxury focused sports car. It didn't.

BMW just knows the simplicity of the M2 will sell and good for them, just like any other trim of any other model.

The e46 m3 was bigger than the e30 and no one complained back then that it was a luxury car, it's just the cycle of cars. The f80/f82 are not luxury focused cars. in fact some of its criticisms are that they ride rough stiff and are uncomfortable.

The m2 is great and why can't it just be great?

[nemex12]

Originally Posted by Law

Wow look at all the M purists in this thread!


Non-M mirrors, Non-S engine, Non-M seats, no relatation to BMW Motorsport (i.e., factory race car), etc. = Modern M3

4 doors = not an M3


The logic is real strong in this thread, thanks for the laugh

well, that shows how bad things are. If the best M car(in terms of sheer driving pleasure most people would agree the M2 is the flagship) doesn't have an M soul, what can we expect from BMW as a performance car company nowadays?
specially as the m2 it is based on a line that is not meant to be their flagship as they use cheaper materials and less interesting design cues for their cheaper models. BMW has compromised so much of their soul that I rarely care to look at their new designs anymore.

[Law]

Originally Posted by Dinh335

I get your premise, and have no desire to enter an m3 vs m2 debate...but what is with this bandwagon that the m3 and m4 are huge luxury focused cars?

If the m2 didn't exist no one would say that. It's an over exagerrated line of thinking that the 3 series moved upscale and have becomes this luxury focused sports car. It didn't.

BMW just knows the simplicity of the M2 will sell and good for them, just like any other trim of any other model.

The e46 m3 was bigger than the e30 and no one complained back then that it was a luxury car, it's just the cycle of cars. The f80/f82 are not luxury focused cars. in fact some of its criticisms are that they ride rough stiff and are uncomfortable.

The m2 is great and why can't it just be great?

Exactly. Size is open to interpretation, but saying that the F80 "sacrifices" driving dynamics for luxury is completely off the mark. Just because you get real leather in an M3, for example, doesn't mean it sacrifices dynamics for luxury. In fact, it means it's a better built car, quality-wise. The M3 has always been known for being the best of both worlds and a bona fide Jekyll and Hyde personality.

[Kung Fu English]

Originally Posted by nemex12

well, that shows how bad things are. If the best M car(in terms of sheer driving pleasure most people would agree the M2 is the flagship) doesn't have an M soul, what can we expect from BMW as a performance car company nowadays?
specially as the m2 it is based on a line that is not meant to be their flagship as they use cheaper materials and less interesting design cues for their cheaper models. BMW has compromised so much of their soul that I rarely care to look at their new designs anymore.

Not sure that's true. If the m4 zcp and m2 cost the same I'm sure everyone would be on board with calling the m4 the "best m car" and having the best driving dynamics.

The m2 is just 100 lb lighter and 100 hp less but it's cheaper so everyone likes it.

[ThugzZ BunnY]

i absolutely loved how they introduced the m2 in this. it put a huge smile on my face.

[Robin_NL]

Originally Posted by Dinh335

The e46 m3 was bigger than the e30 and no one complained back then that it was a luxury car, it's just the cycle of cars.

You bet there were complaints about its size and weight back then! But the internet wasn't as big as it is now but there were complaints, even by me!
I still bought one in 2002 though. Great car. But nowadays a tad overrated imho...

In 2008 I got an E90 M3 6MT, it again got bigger but what the heck it was a V8 'Motorsport' engine in a fat assed car... the next generation... I didn't enjoy it that much tbh. Sportiness gone. It's the whole package that counts and E90 M3 didn't have it for me...

But I enjoyed it when I got my 1M in 2012! Back to nimbleness/agility in a way. Greatest M car I ever had if you take in account the steering/responsivenes/engine imho...

M2 is the better and faster car overall. Easier in many ways. And the MDiff is marvelous on track and on the Streets. Luckily it isn't that big and heavy...

F80 M3 looks and drives great but I found it too big tbh...

Cheers
Robin

[marcva]

Originally Posted by desertfox73

I guess I hear what you're saying, but that's a long time to hold a grudge, given that BMW launched their 4-door M3 over 24 years ago!

Actually, it was in 1997 and 1998. My car is coming up on its 20th birthday...

[desertfox73]

Originally Posted by marcva

Actually, it was in 1997 and 1998. My car is coming up on its 20th birthday...

Actually, I'll split the difference with you...looks like it's a 22 (almost 23) year grudge, not 24:

"The E36 M3 debuted in February 1992 and was in the dealer's showrooms in November that year. It was the first M3 powered by a straight-six engine; the engine used was a 2,990 cc (182 cu in) S50, which produced 210 kW (282 hp).

Initially available as a coupé only, BMW introduced M3 convertible and saloon versions in 1994, the absence of any M5 models in the BMW line-up between the end of E34 M5 production in 1995 and the launch of the E39 M5 in 1998 prompted the introduction of the 4-door Motorsport model."

from: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_M3#E36_M3

Also: http://www.automobile-catalog.com/ma...an_m/1994.html

[nicknaz]

Originally Posted by omasou

M2 really is the modern M3, it reminds me a lot of my E36M3 but with 100+ HP, and loving how it is simplified or maybe more correct not overly complicated, no adaptive suspension, etc. I might have even selected manual seats if they were an option in the US.

Why not just get an e36m3 and do the euro motor swap or otherwise mod it if you want the old school car? Or get an f80 with minimal options (like I did) if you think it's too complex?

I like the idea of the m2 a lot as a smaller package at a lower price but at the end of the day, it's still a 4 seats style car.

I really miss the e86m coupe... 2 doors and 2 seats and low stance is where it's at for a toy car, IMHO

[ONEOF40 FS M3]

I have driven all M cars in the last 20 years including all new Ms and own some of them. The M2 is only good when compared to the new M cars M3 and M4 but outside of that is just another Turbo car which is heavy to be a sports car. It has Turbo lag and sounds awful like the M3 and M4. It can be a nice grocery car with a manual transmission, just fun for a little while but boring in the long run. It is a good looking car, the front fascia is the best part of it.

BMW and the M Divison have become a marketing brand that builts car for the masses. M badges for everyone diluting brand.

[Verdi]

Originally Posted by ONEOF40 FS M3

I have driven all M cars in the last 20 years including all new Ms and own some of them. The M2 is only good when compared to the new M cars M3 and M4 but outside of that is just another Turbo car which is heavy to be a sports car. It has Turbo lag and sounds awful like the M3 and M4. It can be a nice grocery car with a manual transmission, just fun for a little while but boring in the long run. It is a good looking car, the front fascia is the best part of it.

BMW and the M Divison have become a marketing brand that builts car for the masses. M badges for everyone diluting brand.

The M2 isn't heavier than an E46 M3 and probably lighter than the E92 M3. As for the engine. Well, I kind of like turbo engines as it makes it more powerful for normal driving.

As a final note. I can't afford a 991 GTS and you're comparing apples with oranges. The M2 is great for what it is. No need for some stuck up rich guy coming here telling us that our cars are crap...

[ZilberGrau ZHP]

With BMW car sales firmly in the tank- they should up production of the M2 and make more color choices- maybe I'd buy one- not waiting a year and for colors I am not overly crazy about. So a few thousand more people in America will have one - who cares?? great for the brand and us drivers. After all they will make as many M3's and M4's as the audience will take- M2 is the other way around.